Washing Machine advice?

[STONEISLAND]

I need some inspiration or ideas. :angel:

My problem is my washing machine which I have in my brick outhouse. I cannot fit it into my small kitchen as I have a much needed dishwasher in there. :(

The problem being is that when it’s very cold (what with winter round the corner) the pipes freeze and this means I cannot use the washing machine.

I now need a new one as the seal is broken and its leaking water (lucky it’s outside and not in the house).

Is there such a thing as an outside washing machine?
Will it still freeze if I lag pipes with electric lagging? (I have put some lagging on them to no effect) Do I lag the cold flow pipe to machine? Can I insulate the washing machine in anyway? Will this stop the freezing?

Can I get some sort of low temp heating in the outhouse which will keep it above freezing temps without costing the earth?

I can put it where the fridge is in the house but I cannot put the waste pipe down the drain. Can you get some sort of bucket designed for this?:confused:

Many thanks in advance……. :)

[tweetiepooh]

Is there some way that you can empty pipes and cut of water when not using ie stop cocks in house and a tap to drain out the water? That may be another solution.

[Woolly One]

[FONT=Verdana]Is there such a thing as an outside washing machine?
Will it still freeze if I lag pipes with electric lagging? (I have put some lagging on them to no effect) Do I lag the cold flow pipe to machine? Can I insulate the washing machine in anyway? Will this stop the freezing?

Can't be of much help, however, would loft insulation inside the outhouse work? Should raise the temp a bit. Can't say that I've seen a washing machine specifically designed to be placed in an out door building, but lagging every pipe sounds a good idea.

hope this is of some use:)

p.s. - You never know there might be a goverment grant for the loft insulation:)

[Jonathan90]

Nvm

[STONEISLAND]

Is there some way that you can empty pipes and cut of water when not using ie stop cocks in house and a tap to drain out the water? That may be another solution.

like your idear the only problem is that its out in the road and thaty would mean cutting neigbours of to.

There is one in the house not sure if ith does the outside tap or not.
The out house use to be a big outside toliet many years ago.

---------- Post added at 11:42 ---------- Previous post was at 11:39 ----------

:(Can't be of much help, however, would loft insulation inside the outhouse work? Should raise the temp a bit. Can't say that I've seen a washing machine specifically designed to be placed in an out door building, but lagging every pipe sounds a good idea.

hope this is of some use:)

p.s. - You never know there might be a goverment grant for the loft insulation:)

Was thinking about boxing it in with loft insulation, but would that be a fife hazard in the summer?

Thanks for ideas really stuck with this........ :(

---------- Post added at 11:43 ---------- Previous post was at 11:42 ----------

Nvm

Worth a thought.

[Watching You]

I have a Siemens washing machine, replacing the original machine that came from Germany – the best dam machine I ever owned.

Some of these machines Siemen / Bosch are typically designed to be used in remote locations, ie not in the house a garage etc. Providing that you maintain your machine well you should not have too many problem, if you drain it down at the end of use in cold spells. This would mean, in the dark winter nights you have to drain down the water fill pipe and waste access from the machine. But depending on where you live, as in the city we do not have too many days below freezing. The only problem I can see is during a deep winter, if your waste pipe freezes you may not be able to use the machine.

Your only concern would be if it a very damp location, and rust etc.

Yes, there are many devices that will keep your outhouse above freezing, a green house freezer is sufficient, but depending on your budget, gas or electricity can be pricey, but an outhouse is typically not too large an area – I imagine, therefore not too big (and expensive) a space to keep warm.

Better to get rid of the dishwasher unless your family is so large you can justify the need.

[Angua]

I would lag all the pipes with that grey foam stuff and if you can get an inline water stop like this http://www.heatandplumb.com/acatalog/main_product_HAP-BOF01.jpg inside the house on the pipe to the washing machine so you can turn the water flow off in cold weather.

Our washing machine is in the unheated side shed which is only single brick & we have had no problems so far. Would rather go to the launderette than give up the dishwasher :rofl:

[STONEISLAND]

I would lag all the pipes with that grey foam stuff and if you can get an inline water stop like this inside the house on the pipe to the washing machine so you can turn the water flow off in cold weather.

Our washing machine is in the unheated side shed which is only single brick & we have had no problems so far. Would rather go to the launderette than give up the dishwasher :rofl:

I have a splitter in the middle of the pipe already for the cold outtake to the washing machine. It then goes up and out for the outside tap.

If I turn it of when not in use will the water drain away from the washing machine flexi pipe?

What about the pipe to the machine as that’s what has frozen in the past?

[Taf]

Any outside pipework with water in it is liable to freeze. Lagging it might help, but drainage might also freeze, so the machine may not empty.

There is also the safety aspect of having power cables running outside. They must be of the correct type, with the correct plug/socket arrangements.

Then there will be the problem of condensation on electrical parts of the washer in a cold atmosphere.

Do the dishes by hand and get the washing machine indoors?

[Angua]

I have a splitter in the middle of the pipe already for the cold outtake to the washing machine. It then goes up and out for the outside tap.

If I turn it of when not in use will the water drain away from the washing machine flexi pipe?

What about the pipe to the machine as that’s what has frozen in the past?

Once you turn off the water run the machine on a spin setting which should clear any water remaining and if you put the grey foam pipe lagging on the blue plastic pipe and the outlet pipe that should hopefully protect them from any odd drips that might get through.
http://www.wickes.co.uk/content/ebiz/wickes/invt/210010/210010-ab0-00co_medium.jpg
We have a Bosch which was originally purchased in Oman and so far so good but our shed has never frozen.

[STONEISLAND]

Any outside pipework with water in it is liable to freeze. Lagging it might help, but drainage might also freeze, so the machine may not empty.

There is also the safety aspect of having power cables running outside. They must be of the correct type, with the correct plug/socket arrangements.

Then there will be the problem of condensation on electrical parts of the washer in a cold atmosphere.

Do the dishes by hand and get the washing machine indoors?

Good point I do remember the waste pipe freezing as well.

If I box it in and over the top lag it up waste pipe and all, will it be safe to do so?

Moving the dish washer is an absolute last resort.

Thanks all for comments. :)

[altis]

Trouble is, you'll always end up with some water at the bottom of your machine when the cycle finishes. I think you'll need to be very lucky for this not to cause any damage.

I'd go along the lines of:
1)Insulate the walls and roof. This document provides a good introduction to all the practical methods:
http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/uploads/documents/housingbuildings/CE184%20-%20practical%20refurbishment%20of%20solid-walled%20houses.pdf

2)Install a small heater on a frost-stat. Eg: Honeywell T4360 and a low power tubular heater:
http://www.plumbnation.co.uk/site/honeywell-t4360a-1009-frost-thermostat/
http://cpc.farnell.com/HG00258/electrical-lighting-security/product.us0?sku=navman-th1ft060

[STONEISLAND]

Trouble is, you'll always end up with some water at the bottom of your machine when the cycle finishes. I think you'll need to be very lucky for this not to cause any damage.

I'd go along the lines of:
1)Insulate the walls and roof. This document provides a good introduction to all the practical methods:
http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/uploads/documents/housingbuildings/CE184%20-%20practical%20refurbishment%20of%20solid-walled%20houses.pdf

2)Install a small heater on a frost-stat. Eg: Honeywell T4360 and a low power tubular heater:
http://www.plumbnation.co.uk/site/honeywell-t4360a-1009-frost-thermostat/
http://cpc.farnell.com/HG00258/electrical-lighting-security/product.us0?sku=navman-th1ft060

I like the look of this, would it cost much to run?

http://cpc.farnell.com/HG00258/electrical-lighting-security/product.us0?sku=navman-th1ft060

If I got one of them and boxed it all in as room is quiet big and insulated all pipes do you think that will work?

Brilliant ideas.

[MovedGoalPosts]

I'd suggest that tubular heater (it's the sort of thing you often see in greenhouses) is the way to go. Link it to a frost stat and it'll only operate when needed. At 60W it's the same as leaving a lighbulb on, not exactly the totally green, but then if your pipes burst, or washing machine freezes up, then that is'nt exactly green either.

You don't want to box the heater in though, that would defeat the object. The aim is to get the heat to circulate around the pipes and washing machine.

Of course pipe lagging and insulation should be considered in addition to the heater.

[altis]

Say 9 pence per unit, times 0.060 kilowatt, times 24 hours equals 13 pence per day - if it's on all the time. That's why you need a frost-stat.

To be a bit greener: if you have a freezer then you might consider putting that in there too. This will keep the outhouse warm and, because the environment is cooler than in the house, the freezer will use less energy too. You may still need the heater in really cold spells.

[STONEISLAND]

Thanks everyone.

Some great ideas that I will use.

[Matth]

What is the floor, if that is concrete, that can be pretty cold, so if lagging pipes and insulating walls and roof, give some attention to the cold floor as well, especially as it will reduce the power usage of frost-stat heating if you can insulate that.

At a basic level, cushion vinyl would provide some degree of insulation, and also be resilient to spills and splashes.

Another device with a steady power usage is not a bad idea, maybe a chest freezer, as although a freezer is cold inside, the power used becomes heat outside.

The advantage of a chest freezer, is it does not dump large amounts of cold air when opened.

[STONEISLAND]

The floor is concrete.

After much thought and pleases advise if you feel this is a bad idea.

I will make a wooded enclosure with a door which will be like a box that goes to the wall / pipes / sockets / waste. I will lag all pipes waste and feed as well as the flexi pipe to machine.
I will fill the side but not the back of machine (as I don’t want it to over heat in summer) with loft insulation. I will buy one of theses,

http://cpc.farnell.com/HG00258/elect...avman-th1ft060 (http://cpc.farnell.com/HG00258/electrical-lighting-security/product.us0?sku=navman-th1ft060)

an electric plug in thermostat to plug it in with, and put the Tubular which I will put along side the water pipe coming up from the ground as well as the waste pipe within the enclosure.

Will this be safe you think?

Again big thanks to all who’s help with this. :clap:

[Scarlett]

My parents insulated a shed with large sheets of polystyrine (in the gaps between the wooden slats) works fine with the chest freezer in there.

I do know that when I was young they used rolls of polystyrine on the roof of my bedroom and it did wonders for the heat (was toasty, even in the winter) that might help as well.

[altis]

Sounds like you are putting the washer in a box. How is the water vapour to escape? Insulating the walls needn't be difficult. See page 15 of the document in my first link above.

Also, there are many more options for insulation than nasty itchy glass wool - see same doc. If you are determined to make a box then why not just get a fat sheet of polystyrene from B&Q and cut it up into rectangles. Self supporting and light.

[STONEISLAND]

Sounds like you are putting the washer in a box. How is the water vapour to escape? Insulating the walls needn't be difficult. See page 15 of the document in my first link above.

Also, there are many more options for insulation than nasty itchy glass wool - see same doc. If you are determined to make a box then why not just get a fat sheet of polystyrene from B&Q and cut it up into rectangles. Self supporting and light.

Altis I like your style, thanks for the helpful advise.

Of to B&Q then.