View Full Version : 25p/min to call tech support: fair or not?
just wondering who thinks the tech support call charge is fair or not
remembering that you only pay for the call if its your fault!
and theres nothing we can do to determine the call cost form other networks e.g. if your on bt theres nothing stopping you saying your on 1 that cost 75ppm
Do you mean the 25p/min charge for tech support?
emm yeah can you add that to the heading for me
Done. 'don't know' option also added to poll.
And I'm wavering personally - it might just be fair, if it guarantees a quick response to my phone call and a quick resolution once I'm talking to someone.
That said, the only time I've had to do it, I was on the phone talking to them for quite some time. :erm:
ultimate
08-08-2007, 16:02
remembering that you only pay for the call if its your fault!
Who is the say whose fault is it? and will they give us a credit on the phone bill if it is their fault? How does the whole thing work?
thanks, yeah we dont get queues any more cause we dont get daft calls like can you fix my tv cause its like a computer screen, only time we get queues is big outages
---------- Post added at 16:04 ---------- Previous post was at 16:03 ----------
if its a fault with the pc then you pay, if its a fault with virgin you dont, the agents decided whos fault it is
I was forced to call TS to unlock my PID, which is solidly a CS issue. Whilst entering my PID and password it didn't even warn me, just locked it. On that basis i'm going to stick my neck out and say the charges are part of a concerted effort to fleece customers.
Charging 25p/min OK for people who need help getting a router out of a box, but moving CS tasks to TS to screw more money out of me isn't on.
Remember they tried to charge us a package-change charge.
they should of kept the free number, and if the problem wasnt related to an issue that is probably there, just told the customer to call the 25ppm line.
25ppm for indian tech "support" (i use the term loosly) is just a rip off. your not telling me, that in india they get paid 25ppm?
we have the pc help line for this!
i think the phone charges are completely fair
if it's our fault you are credited back for the cost of the call
if it's your fault you pay 25p/m because it shouldn't have been us your call
so really, as long as you only phone us for genuine problems, u will never be charged
and it has worked to reduce the queues on our lines dramatically, for example, just now, no queue at all, before this was implemented, u would have been looking at 7/8 minutes waiting at this time of day most days (and most of them calling us because they had a fault with pc/router, or because there modems were off or in standby)
have to say well done to vm on this one :tu:
mrmistoffelees
08-08-2007, 17:17
I voted dont know
IF the call centres we are all UK based and IF ALL of the agents knew what they were doing and IF they could resolve the issue quickly then yes its fair.
However there is about as much chance of that happening as there is of me solving the political situation in Iraq :erm:
They are not fair, and never will be.
I thought support was supposed to be part of the monthly charge, it certainly should not be some rip-off 25p a minute to listen to music on hold. I will defend VM policy on many things, as I often think they are right - but charging people to report faults is a disgrace IMO.
I certainly don't trust them to "credit me" if it's "their" fault. Who makes that decision (they do, of course ...)
you dont listen to hold music
its a premium rate line and hold is illegal
and support for our issues is part of your monthly charge
support for routers, computers isn't
So what do you listen to while you wait, ring tone ? nothing ? , whatever it is is irrelevant really, charging people to report faults should never happen (and I don't just mean with VM, I dispise it with any company).
they arent charged to report fault if you read it its says you dont get charged if its virgins fault
DiscoStu
08-08-2007, 17:44
Who is the say whose fault is it? and will they give us a credit on the phone bill if it is their fault? How does the whole thing work?
What if you haven't got an NTL line? Do they credit that charge to your main bill?
yeah just take it off the broadband charge
you arent charged to reprt faults
ur credited for our faults!
and u listen to a ringtone as with all premium rate lines.
mrmistoffelees
08-08-2007, 17:47
they arent charged to report fault if you read it its says you dont get charged if its virgins fault
Which is at the agent's discretion..............
no offence but its not hard to decided who the faults with, if the modem or networks cause it you get your money back, if its the pc your dont
only the decision on who fault it is is technically a teh agents discretion
in most cases its pretty clear where the fault is coming from
the credit if its clear it is virgins fault, is mandatory
mrmistoffelees
08-08-2007, 17:52
no offence but its not hard to decided who the faults with, if the modem or networks cause it you get your money back, if its the pc your dont
Ah but not all agents will be as technically knowledgeable and able to communicate effectively in both written and spoken English as your good self. Or will they ?:erm:
Irony is such a wonderful thing. la la la la la la
thats a difficult one, because i wouldnt want to speak to a few of our agents
but the charge i believe is correct, some of the agents they have operating under it... namely vmtech, arent!!
under the new guidelines though regarding leaving notes on accounts with call length, even if oyu do go a indian call centre who isnt helpful, and doesnt credit you correctly, if you call back and get to a british agent, or a better agent in india, tehn they can credit that call and the one your on at that stage. if not if you raise a complaint through cus services even, then the complaints dept can check into it for you and get thsi credited back.
(i'd say it would be very rare that this would have to be done, because most agent even in our indian call centres do no what they're doing
you dont have to be that that technically knowledgeable to know if its a fault with us or the pc, you have to be technically knowledgeable to fix the problem yes but that doesnt stop you getting money back
mrmistoffelees
08-08-2007, 18:06
thats a difficult one, because i wouldnt want to speak to a few of our agents
but the charge i believe is correct, some of the agents they have operating under it... namely vmtech, arent!!
under the new guidelines though regarding leaving notes on accounts with call length, even if oyu do go a indian call centre who isnt helpful, and doesnt credit you correctly, if you call back and get to a british agent, or a better agent in india, tehn they can credit that call and the one your on at that stage. if not if you raise a complaint through cus services even, then the complaints dept can check into it for you and get thsi credited back.
(i'd say it would be very rare that this would have to be done, because most agent even in our indian call centres do no what they're doing
You're missing a 't' in the last part of your sentence, care go guess where it goes ? :D
and support for our issues is part of your monthly charge
support for routers, computers isn't
Not for unlocking your PID which CS used to do for free before this charge was brought in.
i really dont no where it would go
and im not being funny
the only place i can think of would b on "do no(t) what they are doing"
but then that doesnt make sense, i need to put know in there
---------- Post added at 18:11 ---------- Previous post was at 18:10 ----------
the reason that has changed isnt due to the call charge its due to ntl customers being moved on to telewest systems. the telewest system doesnt give access to this
tech support have a couple of extra systems, on of which will be used to unlock that im guessing.
mrmistoffelees
08-08-2007, 18:11
i really dont no where it would go
and im not being funny
the only place i can think of would b on "do no(t) what they are doing"
but then that doesnt make sense, i need to put know in there
I no (sic) was just about to edit my post ;)
lol, no, i no the indian agent can be infuriating, when i have to phone vm or another service and hear an indian accent on the other end of the phone i cringe thinking
"here we go, 20 mins for something that could be done in 5"
but tbh most of the time they're not too bad
and with the call charges, regardless of how long it takes, if it's our fault you get the credit
lucevans
08-08-2007, 19:48
i think the phone charges are completely fair
if it's our fault you are credited back for the cost of the call
if it's your fault you pay 25p/m because it shouldn't have been us your call
so really, as long as you only phone us for genuine problems, u will never be charged
and it has worked to reduce the queues on our lines dramatically, for example, just now, no queue at all, before this was implemented, u would have been looking at 7/8 minutes waiting at this time of day most days (and most of them calling us because they had a fault with pc/router, or because there modems were off or in standby)
have to say well done to vm on this one :tu:
I don't usually argue with people on message boards, but you are just wrong to say "u will never be charged". What you should have said is "you will ALWAYS be charged, and then, if WE judge that the problem is at our end, you may receive a refund from us, 1 - 2 months after you incur the call charges."
I'm sorry if that sounds angry, but customers who pay up to £37 a month for internet services should NOT have to pay up front to report service faults to the ISP, then hope that they'll be refunded this expense at some point in the future. That kind of hidden cost may be acceptable from "budget" ISPs (i.e. the dirt-cheap ADSL outfits) but the subscriptions we pay could in no way be classified as "budget". And to argue that such charges have shortened the call queue only highlights your company's under-investment in technical support - not something I'd be shouting from the rooftops if I were you and I wanted to attract new customers...
Bob
erm... the call charges aren't refunded 1-2 months later, thay are refunded as soon as the clal is finished and will appear on the same bill as the charge for call shows.
the fact it has reduced clal queues is due to the fact it has stopped people calling us who have no reason to be calling us in the first place (computer/router at fauls) i wouldn't say i was shouting anything from the rooftops, merely stating the facts as they are
the comapny should not have to to cover the cost of extra calls because we get hundreds and hundreds of call daily with issues not related to equipment they supply or are licensed to support
iTekweni
08-08-2007, 20:13
I don't usually argue with people on message boards, but you are just wrong to say "u will never be charged". What you should have said is "you will ALWAYS be charged, and then, if WE judge that the problem is at our end, you may receive a refund from us, 1 - 2 months after you incur the call charges."
I'm sorry if that sounds angry, but customers who pay up to £37 a month for internet services should NOT have to pay up front to report service faults to the ISP, then hope that they'll be refunded this expense at some point in the future. That kind of hidden cost may be acceptable from "budget" ISPs (i.e. the dirt-cheap ADSL outfits) but the subscriptions we pay could in no way be classified as "budget". And to argue that such charges have shortened the call queue only highlights your company's under-investment in technical support - not something I'd be shouting from the rooftops if I were you and I wanted to attract new customers...
Bob
I have to agree with you as since my upgrade to 10meg and a free to so called 20meg my broadband has got so slow sometimes it is not worth going onto the net. So I am paying £37 a month for BB and when I want to use the internet I can't because its slower than what I previously had.
theres more than enough slow speeds threads so im not gona comment on your speeds, but if you are sure that the fault is virginmedia's end and have done all your checks then there is no reason not to call, as as previously stated, if its our end, as soon as the calls finished the agent will credit ur account with the correct amount
Has the number of reported faults dropped since the charging was introduced?
If so, I bet the person who suggested the charges has got a big fat bonus. In one fell swoop they managed to bring on an additional revenue stream and reduce the number of reported faults. Genius.
Only...I would bet that the number of actual, unreported faults plus the reported ones hasn't decreased at all. In fact, consider this; it isn't beyond the realms of possibility that early signs of more serious problems will go unreported due to customer reluctance to incur a charge and, when the brown sticky stuff hits the fan, it's too late and takes longer to fix at greater expense. Counter productive? I should say so.
they arent charged to report fault if you read it its says you dont get charged if its virgins fault
Of course you get charged, you get charged as the call is being made.
Also, as I said ;
I certainly don't trust them to "credit me" if it's "their" fault. Who makes that decision (they do, of course ...)
It's all very well saying that they won't credit you a month later - what if it's an intermittant fault that takes a month or two to locate, and numerous calls in between time. Not every fault is clear cut and solved in 5 minutes.
You should not be charged to report a fault, end of story.
If VM feel a fault was ultimately not their fault, then they should levy a charge (and be able to prove it's justified). It should not be the current system of "shoot first, ask questions later".
the number fo reported faults ahsnt went down in my opinion
i'd say theres isnt any more or less issues than there was before the charging got introduced, at the end of the day if people have a problem and they have done all their own checks, they should phone in.
this wasnt introduced to discourage customers from reporting faults, it was introduced to reduce the number of calls we recieved regarding 3rd party equip and unrelated issues
and im sure there was an idea to increase profit margins as well, which il admit is unusual for a business to want to do that
but, for the less tech savvy (I'll use my dad as an example as I always do), if their BB is down then they will call TS. If there is a chance that the fault is with their router and have no idea why, then they are going to be reluctant to take the risk of having to cash in their pension for the pleasure of being told, "It's nowt to do wi' us gov. Yer on yer own".
It's all very well saying that they won't credit you a month later - what if it's an intermittant fault that takes a month or two to locate, and numerous calls in between time. Not every fault is clear cut and solved in 5 minutes.
You should not be charged to report a fault, end of story.
If VM feel a fault was ultimately not their fault, then they should levy a charge (and be able to prove it's justified). It should not be the current system of "shoot first, ask questions later".
this is very unusual circumstances where i suppose it may take a little bit of time for the fault to become clear, and okay il admit, in these very rare circumstances you may not immediatly be credited and it may wait until the next months bill... but at the end of the day the charges still credited
applying charges months down the line just isnt practical
(and im not sure that it's legal, without having a basis)
this way it is conducted under guideline who are the body who decide if the charge is fair or unfair
and if im not mistaking, with them allowing the line to continue at premium rate, they must thinks it fair
7@m3 G33k
08-08-2007, 22:05
just wondering who thinks the tech support call charge is fair or not
remembering that you only pay for the call if its your fault!
and theres nothing we can do to determine the call cost form other networks e.g. if your on bt theres nothing stopping you saying your on 1 that cost 75ppm
It's all very well to keep repeating "you won't be charged if it's VM's problem" but that is not a clear-cut issue. You ought to know that yourself. I speak from experience of both sides of this issue as Telewest/VM BB customer and my job doing 2nd & 3rd line IT support for a uni (and occasionally covering our own phone-in help desk when the regular team have meetings or are short-staffed): a substantial proportion of tech support calls are not black & white in terms of cause.
I recently had occasion to contact VM tech support as I wanted to use an IMAP mail client on my laptop for my Blueyonder e-mail account (your webmail system is so *utterly* dire after all) and I couldn't find any reference to the name of your IMAP server on your (also *utterly* dire - not even a search option!) website help pages. I didn't think I should have to pay for this information so I used the website support form (http://help2.virginmedia.com/help/getContent.jspx?page=h_services_bybb) thinking that I would get a response to such a simple query in less than 24 hours. (Remember that VM's PR line for introducing charges for tech support was to *improve* support to customers - presumably this also meant support via web form/e-mail).
I waited four working days without reply. So I sent another message (slightly irate this time) including a copy of the original query. A few days passed....no reply and then I was off on holiday out of the country for a week. Got back...no reply. Finally I got a response *two and a half weeks* after I sent my initial query! I'd be sacked in a month if that was the response time I gave customers where I work!
Oddly enough I was just a little bit pi**ed off with VM tech support by now. So I replied: I thanked the support person (who I won't name here) for the information and then detailed why I wished to make a formal complaint about how bad this service was. In doing so I scoured VM's help pages once more and actually found the information I had requested by web form in the section Setting Up Outlook 2000 For Email (http://help2.virginmedia.com/help/getContent.jspx?page=h_email_setup_outlook2000) - not the right place for the information and as don't use any flavour of Outlook let alone the antiquated Outlook 2000 I was lucky to find it at all.
To date no response to my last message of complaint sent almost two weeks ago. Would I have had to pay for call to tech support for this information given that it did actually exist (albeit in a stupid place) on your help pages? A better question it seems to me is why have VM introduced the blunt instrument of charging to weed out inappropriate calls and *allegedly* improve customer support? Why not train staff to politely end calls that are clearly inappropriate? Surely the charging is not vain attempt to claw back a little revenue lost due to the flood of customers leaving VM? As if! :shocked:
alferret
08-08-2007, 22:16
Yes its fair because if the fault is found to be a VM fault you can get all charges refunded, if it turns out to be something other than VM you'll be charged for wasting company time.
7@m3 G33k
08-08-2007, 22:44
Yes its fair because if the fault is found to be a VM fault you can get all charges refunded, if it turns out to be something other than VM you'll be charged for wasting company time.
Would it be cynical of me to wonder if a percentage of the revenue from the tech support line goes to VM employees posting the PR mantra "you won't be charged if it's VM's fault" onto cable forums? :dozey: Does it pay by the line? Or do you get extra for being creative and using your own words? And is there a special bonus for engaging your brain and backing up a bland statement with some argument? (Sorry pal - you clearly failed on that last one!)
And how about VM refunding customers for wasting *their* time when we have to wait 20....30....40 minutes or more to get through to the customer service number to complain that tech support have not bothered to reply to our e-mail for two weeks? Quid pro quo..
Not fair at all rip off to be honest, some people dont have a home phone and have to phone from outside ie a phonebox which might i add costs over 1 pound per min just to get some idiot reading a script.
Do they refund us for **** service no.
arcamalpha2004
08-08-2007, 22:58
Would it be cynical of me to wonder if a percentage of the revenue from the tech support line goes to VM employees posting the PR mantra "you won't be charged if it's VM's fault" onto cable forums? :dozey: Does it pay by the line? Or do you get extra for being creative and using your own words? And is there a special bonus for engaging your brain and backing up a bland statement with some argument? (Sorry pal - you clearly failed on that last one!)
And how about VM refunding customers for wasting *their* time when we have to wait 20....30....40 minutes or more to get through to the customer service number to complain that tech support have not bothered to reply to our e-mail for two weeks? Quid pro quo..
" Wasting Time " is only a one way street so far as vm are concerned.
They are not " Wasting Time " when a customer has taken a day off work to wait in for a tech that will not show.
Perhaps things should be more equal?
How about if a customer has a failed tech show that customer is given 12 months free subscription to the top package?
I am sure a company of their standing can afford it.
I think applying the charge is a rip off.
They are not fair, and never will be.
I thought support was supposed to be part of the monthly charge, it certainly should not be some rip-off 25p a minute to listen to music on hold. I will defend VM policy on many things, as I often think they are right - but charging people to report faults is a disgrace IMO.
I certainly don't trust them to "credit me" if it's "their" fault. Who makes that decision (they do, of course ...)
I agree 101% :tu:
Im a avid fan of Virgin Media and Richard Branson (as you can see from my previous posts) but this whole premium rate tech support line sucks bigtime.
It wouldnt be so bad if I didnt get sent to India to speak to someone reading a script.
If im going to have to pay 25p per min to speak to someone, I at least expect them to understand me and vice versa!!!! and not to start reading from a script, how they have the cheek to call this TECH SUPPORT! is beyond me!!
I dont care if its credited back, this is incovenient, as it comes off the Broadband bill, and NOT my Mobile Phone bill.
If im paying FULL WHACK £37.99 for my Broadband I dont expect to have to pay 25pm for support.
---------- Post added at 23:15 ---------- Previous post was at 22:59 ----------
I'm sorry if that sounds angry, but customers who pay up to £37 a month for internet services should NOT have to pay up front to report service faults to the ISP, then hope that they'll be refunded this expense at some point in the future.
Well said Bob!
Only the 20Meg customers on retention deals should have to pay not us folks paying full whack :D :D
JOKE!!! ;)
Im just wondering as well, how many people that dont know about the call being refunded routine are just getting charged anyway?
Im sure agents dont automatically say, OH THE FAULT IS OUR END! HERE HAVE THE CALL REFUNDED!!!
This must be a right little earner for VM and Branson, Thank GoD my connection works, thats all I can say!
lucevans
08-08-2007, 23:21
erm... the call charges aren't refunded 1-2 months later, thay are refunded as soon as the clal is finished and will appear on the same bill as the charge for call shows.
No. Virgin Media cannot apply refunds to my British Telecom phone bill. If VM choose to "credit" me with the cost of calls I have made to technical support to tell them that their service is down, the earliest opportunity they will have to return my money will be on the next monthly broadband direct debit payment. Because of the dates that VM and BT take their monthly direct debits from my account, it could be 1 or even 2 months after the charge for the phone call is taken by BT before VM apply any reduction to my broadband direct debit payment.
Get it now?
As this poll seems like a serious request I would just like to add my two pennyworth. I cannot judge the service as I have never yet needed to call technical since it was a pay service. But where i read on another post in this forum was the guy who phoned to report a fault that he took the trouble to check the status lines, then told he would be charged for the call as the problem showed on the techs status line which is different from the public status line, and only after a long discussion having to explain that he was not aware from what he had access to that there was a general fault that the techy relented and refunded the call cost.(all this from memory and I hope I got the facts right) Now thats not fair, and the reason for it is that the system relies on techies opinion in what is or is not refundable. What I woujld like to hear about is: What is the average call time to techs from peoples experience and were they charged for the call, also bearing in mind that there is a 10 pence connection charge every time as well as the 25p/min.
John Calleja
As this poll seems like a serious request I would just like to add my two pennyworth. I cannot judge the service as I have never yet needed to call technical since it was a pay service. But where i read on another post in this forum was the guy who phoned to report a fault that he took the trouble to check the status lines, then told he would be charged for the call as the problem showed on the techs status line which is different from the public status line, and only after a long discussion having to explain that he was not aware from what he had access to that there was a general fault that the techy relented and refunded the call cost.(all this from memory and I hope I got the facts right)
Sounds right to me :) :(
---------- Post added at 01:45 ---------- Previous post was at 01:44 ----------
Isn't it strange how I recognise at least 50% of the yes voters as employees of VM. :scratch:
what happens if the tech cant find where the problems is??
would they assume the problem is with the customer??
even though it might not be??
ok you lot have to realise virgin is a business the whole point of it is to make money, there not there to make customers happy by supporting everything in the house thats electronic, fact of the matter is if the dont make money the will shutdown, with that in mind how can you say its not fair, most calls are answered straight away(exceptions when we have a big outage)no more 10min queues, customers dont spend 15min arguing about if they got the router from us or not, if we should support routers or not, if the faults with vm or the pc, they accept what they are told and use the advised we give to correct the problem and most of the stuff that customer wants(non fault stuff) is on the vm help site(has pictures as well) so if they want free help they can go there or they can pay a small fee for us to do it(its not that much before someone says it £5.10 max vm will charge(not vms fault other lines charge more))
most agents know what they are doing, its not easy for everyone but most people get the hang of it pretty quick and if they dont then they get moved basically, dont get me wrong we make mistakes no1s perfect but thats what complaints and feedback are for(before you say if an agent makes a mistake you get your money back, i had to do that the day) so if an agent cant do his job its picked up on pretty quickly and the appropriate action is taken.
if you have a problem with indian call centers complain to customers services moaning on here isn't going to get rid of them, am not happy with some of them as well so when ones being useless they get feedback put through just like i would expect myself if i wasn't doing my job but unless you complain about them they wont be going anywere, its not all of them some of them know what they are doing and do it well.
my average call time is about 5min obviously different each day but its round about that most days, which is a huge drop from before the premium call charge
the imap servers arn't that had to find its in the help sections and its in selfcare(email section under connections)
---------- Post added at 02:17 ---------- Previous post was at 02:16 ----------
smilie if a tech cant find the problem 1st we would advised the customer we will call them back then speak to another agent then have the connection to the ubr checked
ian@huth
09-08-2007, 10:43
erm... the call charges aren't refunded 1-2 months later, thay are refunded as soon as the clal is finished and will appear on the same bill as the charge for call shows.
the fact it has reduced clal queues is due to the fact it has stopped people calling us who have no reason to be calling us in the first place (computer/router at fauls) i wouldn't say i was shouting anything from the rooftops, merely stating the facts as they are
the comapny should not have to to cover the cost of extra calls because we get hundreds and hundreds of call daily with issues not related to equipment they supply or are licensed to supportI can't see how using this 0906 number has reduced the number of calls and the wait time to speak to an agent. Why do you think that all those calls that shouldn't be going to broadband support will miraculously stop? Any reduction is probably due to customers not knowing the new number to call. Most Customers who get a problem with their broadband will still think it is a VM problem and either telephone to try to get the issue resolved or forget about the problem and hope it automatically gets resolved.
Moving to a premium rate support number could increase the churn of customers leaving Virgin Media. If a customer finds a problem with their broadband they will probably ring one of the old numbers. If they are then told to call another number at premium rates they could easily think about things like the £26 Sky offering of TV, internet and phone.
erm... the call charges aren't refunded 1-2 months later, thay are refunded as soon as the clal is finished and will appear on the same bill as the charge for call shows.
Does this work for ADSL customers as well, who will be calling in on a BT line? Is the cost of the call deducted from the next month's charge for internet service?
7@m3 G33k
09-08-2007, 11:31
No No No No No No No No
Erm...that's still a bit ambiguous JMc - are you saying no? :erm:
Now back to my rant... ;)
ok you lot have to realise virgin is a business the whole point of it is to make money, there not there to make customers happy by supporting everything in the house thats electronic, fact of the matter is if the dont make money the will shutdown
Bless your little cotton socks...I do admire your loyalty to your employer vmtech! Ok I'll do a deal with you: I'll stop patronising you like that if you stop patronising us VM paying customers! :p: Actually Telewest/VM hasn't turned a profit in a while (have a look on El Reg (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/08/08/virgin_q2_2007/)) due mainly to poor debt-financed acquisition/merger decisions and, more recently, haemorraging customers.
Charging for BB tech support will not make one jot of difference to VM's financial situation and is not designed to. It is simply a botched attempt to deal with a geniune issue. Rather than invest in staff training and other systems to cut down the effect of inappropriate calls VM have instead just alienated another bunch of customers. Remember who customers are vmtech? No, we're not always right but we *are* VM's money - when you're losing money and customers the last thing you need to do is p*ss-off even more of us. Call me old-fashioned but if I was a VM exec I'd be contemplating how to make customers happy so they stay loyal to VM and spend more money.
no more 10min queues
No, but as I said: huge waits to get through to customer service, 50 minutes on one occasion for me :mad:
customers dont spend 15min arguing about if they got the router from us or not, if we should support routers or not, if the faults with vm or the pc, they accept what they are told and use the advised we give to correct the problem and most of the stuff that customer wants(non fault stuff) is on the vm help site(has pictures as well) so if they want free help they can go there or they can pay a small fee for us to do it
...
the imap servers arn't that had to find its in the help sections and its in selfcare(email section under connections)
Sorry vmtech - I do have to patronise you one last time: you've been in the tech-support biz for 5 minutes and you know it all already do you? Ah bless! You were still in nappies when I started in IT support and the same goes for many others here. Tech support issues are often clear-cut as you say, but often they are not as well. There is life beyond the scrip and the sooner you realise that the sooner you will really start to learn about quality tech support.
I told you where I found the IMAP server information: are you saying that that is an appropriate place for it to be located? Here's a novel idea: put a link in the e-mail section labelled "E-Mail Servers" :dunce: (I won't charge you for that idea - pop it in the web-team's suggestion box at work). And the info is not in the Selfcare section that I can see. If it is then post the link here.
Ok...breathe deeply...calm down...try not to think about VM for at least 15 minutes... :rolleyes:
How much of a hassle is it going to be to get the charges dropped if it is there fault? Seriously i would not trust this lot to credit my account after all i have never had the correct bill in 7 months, it's like a lottery how much of a cock up on my bill can they make this month.....
dont talk down to me, dont care who you are!!
its not loyalty to my employer, if that was the case would i have sky??
i just think its a fair charge and it gives us a lot less hassle, as well as its make vm remove useless agents as they cant have agent on the phone that dont know what they are doing. it will help vms financial situation as it help pay for us!
customers service queues has nothing to do with technical support queues!
we dont use scripts, if that was the case a wouldnt be working here!
i dont see what my age has do with any of this, just because am not as old as you doesnt make my opinion any less valuable, would you of left that comment if my age wasnt at the side?
in email section called email connections, i cant take screen shots in work because of dpa.
funny how you done little arguing with what i said, all you really done was talk down to me!
chris T do you mean with virgin.net?
They are not fair because half of the time the person you are talking to doesn't have a clue!
By the way sorry to those who work tech and know what they are talking about
chris T do you mean with virgin.net?
Yes, although you don't market it under that name any more. It's all just Virgin Media, the ADSL service is rather euphemistically called 'non cable'. http://allyours.virginmedia.com/html/internet/noncable.html
okay, i want to make it clear that i am speaking from my own opinion here and it has nothing to do with the fact i work for virginmedia, as am more than happy to admit theey arent perfect and could do a lot of things a lot better
when i first heard about the call charges (as with most employees) we thought it was a terrible idea that was just going to cuase us more trouble with irate customers and lose the company customers.
but with the call charges having been in for just over a month, it is clear to see a drop in the scale of calls we get with unrelated equipment, customer errors (leaving the modem in standby/not pluged in) it does make thing a lot simpler
and while it may not make a huge difference with regards to overall profits, any business is always looking for ways to improve revenue with this they have improved revenue and reduced strain on the tech support department. and when it is our issue we always credit back, and the customers do seem to appreciate this.
we do credit the account as soon as soon as the call is over regardless of whether the customer requests the refund or not. if it is our fault we do credit and it will appear on the next broadband bill. theres not a lot we can do about the fact you have a bt (or other phoneline) which is billed at a seperate time.
and maybe to reduce the length of cus services queues we should make it 50p/min :p:
dont know to be honest never spoke to the before
7@m3 G33k
09-08-2007, 15:30
dont talk down to me, dont care who you are!!
Precisely my point: don't talk down to us and I won't talk down to you - not nice is it?
i just think its a fair charge and it gives us a lot less hassle
Fair point, but only a small part of the issue: it's bad from a customer point of view, it can only encourage more customer's to leave VM and there are smarter ways to achieve the same goal without upsetting customers.
it will help vms financial situation as it help pay for us!
The average paying customer is worth about £500/year to VM in monthly charges; on average how much is each customer likely to spend on the support line? Really vmtech, it's small beer in comparison, it's not really about the revenue.
i dont see what my age has do with any of this, just because am not as old as you doesnt make my opinion any less valuable, would you of left that comment if my age wasnt at the side?
You're right, totally unfair of me. But the things you say do suggest a general lack of experience in tech support, your age just confirms what I can tell from what you say: at most you've been working there for a year or two.
in email section called email connections, i cant take screen shots in work because of dpa.
Really? I go to www.virginmedia.com -> Customer Zone -> Need some help? -> Email help :confused: No link for email communications! Post a *link*, you know: http://www.virgingmedia.com/utter_tosh....
---------- Post added at 15:30 ---------- Previous post was at 15:24 ----------
but with the call charges having been in for just over a month, it is clear to see a drop in the scale of calls we get with unrelated equipment, customer errors (leaving the modem in standby/not pluged in) it does make thing a lot simpler
I don't think anyone is disputing what you say (or what what? says... :erm:) - my point is that there are cleverer ways to achieve exactly the same goals without introducing a premium rate line and upsetting customers with legitimate tech support queries.
when was i talking down to you?
its there to stop customers wasting our time, we are here to fix your bb not everything
what does that have to do with anything theres only so much i have to know in order to do my job!
dont now were it is on there but its in selfcare
its there to stop customers wasting our time <snip>
This, I feel, is the festering heart of VM's long-standing customer relations problem. The attitude that customers are out to 'waste your time'. The results of such an attitude are CSRs who are either combative and unhelpful, or expert spinners of BS in order to get said customers off the phone as soon as possible.
Most customers, even those who call you to talk about a problem that turns out to be a pwn3d PC, are not out to waste your time. They are simply in over their heads and don't know what to do about it. A little more compassion would go down a treat. Until your CS operations managers, and their paymasters, grasp this, then truly excellent customer service will continue to elude them.
7@m3 G33k
09-08-2007, 15:54
any examples?
Oh please - there have been plenty of examples given on this forum over the past weeks! But to repeat one from this thread for your benefit:
Why not train staff to politely end calls that are clearly inappropriate?
I'm sure there are many other ways to manage this but there are people at VM getting paid a lot more than I do to dream up such schemes and it's not my area of expertise: how about they do the job they're getting paid to do and actually improve customers' experience of VM?
If they don't then I will join the throng leaving VM soon enough and in time that means you and vmtech and lots of other VM employees may well end up being made redundant. I don't want to see that - I just want to pay a fair price for a decent service and not be treated like an idiot to be milked for cash because VM execs can't run their business effectively. :grind:
when i say wasting our time i dont mean with askig for help i mean when they refuse to listen to our advise, demand help with routers or other 3rd party equipment
we work in outsourced centre so no chance of being made redundant :D
politely end calls that are inappropriate. doesn't thsi still bring up the issue of deciding who's equipment is at fault. whch would again then be complained about relentlessly on this and other forums.
sometimes the least popular methods are the most functional.
mrmistoffelees
09-08-2007, 16:08
we work in outsourced centre so no chance of being made redundant :D
politely end calls that are inappropriate. doesn't thsi still bring up the issue of deciding who's equipment is at fault. whch would again then be complained about relentlessly on this and other forums.
sometimes the least popular methods are the most functional.
You still have to decide whose equipment is at fault on the premium rate line, so i fail to see any relevance ??
---------- Post added at 16:08 ---------- Previous post was at 16:07 ----------
we work in outsourced centre so no chance of being made redundant :D
politely end calls that are inappropriate. doesn't thsi still bring up the issue of deciding who's equipment is at fault. whch would again then be complained about relentlessly on this and other forums.
sometimes the least popular methods are the most functional.
Shows what you know about the mechanics of a call centre then doesn't it ;)
my point was more how that way would be any better
mrmistoffelees
09-08-2007, 16:11
my point was more how that way would be any better
I got the my point bit but after that eh ???
we work in outsourced centre so no chance of being made redundant :D
Good grief ... you've got to be aged about 18 and in your first job. I seriously hope you never find out the hard way that there is never, ever 'no chance of being made redundant'.
beause they dont spend 20min on the call arguing with us if we support routers or not
Good grief ... you've got to be aged about 18 and in your first job. I seriously hope you never find out the hard way that there is never, ever 'no chance of being made redundant'.
im sorry for not wording it correctly the first time, but i meant no chance of me being made redundant with regards to vm losing custom. there are many other projects within the building that i would be moved too.
mrmistoffelees
09-08-2007, 16:19
beause they dont spend 20min on the call arguing with us if we support routers or not
So what you are saying is you're incapable of saying politely "Sorry Sir/Madam we don't support that equipment" and then releasing the call ???
How do you use a keyboard then ? oh, wait you can't. Well, not properly
I got the my point bit but after that eh ???
i dont see how it would be any better
it would still leave angry customers, not happy that they were being hung up on, most of whom would call back believing they had spoke to an incompetant agent. creating bigger queues
yes we do so that over and over but vm dont like us hanging up on customers because they just callback to put a complaint throught which can take a long time to put throught, then the next person will have to explain why they hung up
Well, if nothing else, the 25p per minute charge means you two now have so little to do you can spend your shift posting on here instead of answering the phone. ;)
Well, if nothing else, the 25p per minute charge means you two now have so little to do you can spend your shift posting on here instead of answering the phone. ;)
In the "l33t-5p34k" of the yout' of today - pwned! :D
at this time of the day it was always quiet
anytime now we'll hit our busy period tho
lol multitasking we get calls about every 2min, its just not that busy the now doesnt really pick up till 5ish
alferret
09-08-2007, 20:05
Would it be cynical of me to wonder if a percentage of the revenue from the tech support line goes to VM employees posting the PR mantra "you won't be charged if it's VM's fault" onto cable forums? :dozey: Does it pay by the line? Or do you get extra for being creative and using your own words? And is there a special bonus for engaging your brain and backing up a bland statement with some argument? (Sorry pal - you clearly failed on that last one!)
And how about VM refunding customers for wasting *their* time when we have to wait 20....30....40 minutes or more to get through to the customer service number to complain that tech support have not bothered to reply to our e-mail for two weeks? Quid pro quo..
Yes it would be cynical of you to wonder. Then again I wonder sometimes too. I wonder about you and your motives for the posts you make.
So you would like me to engage my brain and back up my bland statement with an argument. Without listing every single possibility of problems that would be classed as VM’s fault IE: Any technical fault on VM’s network up to and including the modem in your home and then every possible problem that would be classed as your fault IE: anything from the Ethernet\USB cable to your PC and including all hardware and software you have installed I would find it difficult to offer an all round opinion of who should pay, which is what I summarised in one sentence.
7@m3 G33k
09-08-2007, 21:02
Yes it would be cynical of you to wonder. Then again I wonder sometimes too. I wonder about you and your motives for the posts you make.
Just for the record (in case it wasn't bl**din' obvious!) I don't for one second think that VM seriously cares one jot about what is written on forums, certainly not to the extent of encouraging employees to post the PR line on them. That kinda thing always backfires anyway when found out.
As for my motives I've stated them pretty clearly: I want a decent service for a money I pay to VM every month and that service should include free & prompt access to service-related information e.g. server names. If VM had half-decent technical information on their website i.e. not buried obscurely in the wrong place, or if I knew I would get a response to an e-mail query within one working day (not unreasonable I think) then I wouldn't mind so much about charging for phone tech support. But I would still be of the opinion that there are far better ways for VM resolve the problem of inappropriate calls.
what would these other ways be???
Oh please - there have been plenty of examples given on this forum over the past weeks! But to repeat one from this thread for your benefit:
I'm sure there are many other ways to manage this but there are people at VM getting paid a lot more than I do to dream up such schemes and it's not my area of expertise: how about they do the job they're getting paid to do and actually improve customers' experience of VM?
If they don't then I will join the throng leaving VM soon enough and in time that means you and vmtech and lots of other VM employees may well end up being made redundant. I don't want to see that - I just want to pay a fair price for a decent service and not be treated like an idiot to be milked for cash because VM execs can't run their business effectively. :grind:
this is as much as he'll give away so far, but i think he's got something up his sleeve
arcamalpha2004
09-08-2007, 21:48
Does this work for ADSL customers as well, who will be calling in on a BT line? Is the cost of the call deducted from the next month's charge for internet service?
Chris, my scenario exactly.
Having recently been mugged by the charge, that will lie in vm's bank account and gain interest for them, ( multiply that by x customers who have need to call tech support and it is not small interest we are talking ) when the call was terminating I asked what would happen in my case, I have a BT line, the techy told me it would be deducted from my next bill.
The techy also told me that they can give 20mb, no mention of " upto 20mb "
It was " we can give 20 mb no problems "
I was on 4mb service, was upgraded to 20mb as a sweetener to stay, because even opening a web page was quicker achieved having my grandson draw one.
So vm need to address some serious questions, the matter of these call charges is little meat compared to the bigger picture
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2007/08/48.png (http://www.speedtest.net)
Anyone thinking of getting 20mb save your money.
lucevans
09-08-2007, 22:16
okay, i want to make it clear that i am speaking from my own opinion here and it has nothing to do with the fact i work for virginmedia, as am more than happy to admit theey arent perfect and could do a lot of things a lot better
when i first heard about the call charges (as with most employees) we thought it was a terrible idea that was just going to cause us more trouble with irate customers and lose the company customers.
but with the call charges having been in for just over a month, it is clear to see a drop in the scale of calls we get with unrelated equipment, customer errors (leaving the modem in standby/not pluged in) it does make thing a lot simpler
and while it may not make a huge difference with regards to overall profits, any business is always looking for ways to improve revenue with this they have improved revenue and reduced strain on the tech support department. and when it is our issue we always credit back, and the customers do seem to appreciate this.
we do credit the account as soon as soon as the call is over regardless of whether the customer requests the refund or not. if it is our fault we do credit and it will appear on the next broadband bill. theres not a lot we can do about the fact you have a bt (or other phoneline) which is billed at a seperate time.
and maybe to reduce the length of cus services queues we should make it 50p/min :p:
Okay, so you say you've seen a relative reduction in the number of calls that you attribute to what you call "unrelated equipment" and "customer errors". How much of a reduction in calls attributable to "provision failure" have you recorded? Assuming the high level of ignorance that you attribute to the average VM customer, statistics predict that there will be a similar proportion of customers who are having problems with their connection due to a problem at your end, being put-off calling you because of the new call charges. So, to use your description, a "drop in scale of calls" from customers who have lost service due to you, and not their equipment, has occured over the same period. The implication of this is that you are deliberately trying to put-off customers who are suffering genuine service failure from reporting it, by imposing punitive charges.
As for your assertion that there's "not a lot we can do about the fact you have a bt (or other phoneline) which is billed at a seperate time."....there's one very simple thing you can do: stop charging us for reporting faults with your service.
Bob
hokkers999
09-08-2007, 22:35
dont talk down to me, dont care who you are!!
its not loyalty to my employer, if that was the case would i have sky??
i just think its a fair charge and it gives us a lot less hassle, as well as its make vm remove useless agents as they cant have agent on the phone that dont know what they are doing. it will help vms financial situation as it help pay for us!
customers service queues has nothing to do with technical support queues!
we dont use scripts, if that was the case a wouldnt be working here!
i dont see what my age has do with any of this, just because am not as old as you doesnt make my opinion any less valuable, would you of left that comment if my age wasnt at the side?
in email section called email connections, i cant take screen shots in work because of dpa.
funny how you done little arguing with what i said, all you really done was talk down to me!
chris T do you mean with virgin.net?
And you need to learn that you never ever talk down to customers, you might have done it in school before they broke up last month but in the real world we will leave for another supplier and then you haven't got a job.
don't they teach anything in school nowadays - YOU CAN'T WIN AN ARGUMENT WITH A CUSTOMER.
Get that into your brain and you *MAY* have some sort of a future in tech support.
alferret
09-08-2007, 22:52
And you need to learn that you never ever talk down to customers, you might have done it in school before they broke up last month but in the real world we will leave for another supplier and then you haven't got a job.
don't they teach anything in school nowadays - YOU CAN'T WIN AN ARGUMENT WITH A CUSTOMER.
Get that into your brain and you *MAY* have some sort of a future in tech support.
Let me ask you this, if you are that unhappy with the service provided by VM why dont you take your custom elsewhere? and obviously you never learnt manners in school, insulting people doesnt get you anywhere.
hokkers999
09-08-2007, 22:59
Let me ask you this, if you are that unhappy with the service provided by VM why dont you take your custom elsewhere? and obviously you never learnt manners in school, insulting people doesnt get you anywhere.
I downgraded to the 2 meg service and saved £19/month so actually I DID put my money where my mouth is (part of the reason for the change was also the fiver non dd charge).
I don't need support from people who were born AFTER I started work in IT thank you very much.
Okay, so you say you've seen a relative reduction in the number of calls that you attribute to what you call "unrelated equipment" and "customer errors". How much of a reduction in calls attributable to "provision failure" have you recorded? Assuming the high level of ignorance that you attribute to the average VM customer, statistics predict that there will be a similar proportion of customers who are having problems with their connection due to a problem at your end, being put-off calling you because of the new call charges. So, to use your description, a "drop in scale of calls" from customers who have lost service due to you, and not their equipment, has occured over the same period. The implication of this is that you are deliberately trying to put-off customers who are suffering genuine service failure from reporting it, by imposing punitive charges.
As for your assertion that there's "not a lot we can do about the fact you have a bt (or other phoneline) which is billed at a seperate time."....there's one very simple thing you can do: stop charging us for reporting faults with your service.
Bob
well, i dont think iv had any calls (and this is the genuine truth) where a customer has said,
"my broadband has been off for x numer of days days, but iv not call in because of the call charge/i thought id give it a chance to clear itself/i thought it was an issue on my side"
obv thats just me, i dont if other agent have
have also seen a large drop in the number of calls where a customer has got a router attached (most seem to be removing them before calling now im guessing) and most people do now seem to at least try rebooting the equipment (more do so now it would seem than did before when it was advised on the automated system to do so)
obviously no one likes being charged for a service, ecspecially one that was free for so long, but teh company have made the decision now and are going to stick by it. it is also agreed under icstis regulations that this is a fair charge being applied, otherwise vm would not be allowed to use this number and apply these charges
---------- Post added at 23:04 ---------- Previous post was at 23:01 ----------
And you need to learn that you never ever talk down to customers, you might have done it in school before they broke up last month but in the real world we will leave for another supplier and then you haven't got a job.
don't they teach anything in school nowadays - YOU CAN'T WIN AN ARGUMENT WITH A CUSTOMER.
Get that into your brain and you *MAY* have some sort of a future in tech support.
okay, this comment really does annoy me a little bit
bringing some1 age and level of education into this is uncalled for, end of,
that is a terible insult to give anyone
he si on here expressing his personal opinion, on here you are not a customer and he he is not being paid by vm to come on here and offer advice, he does this as a member of the public just like you
vm employee or not he IS entitled to his opinion
ian@huth
09-08-2007, 23:05
when i say wasting our time i dont mean with askig for help i mean when they refuse to listen to our advise, demand help with routers or other 3rd party equipmentWhat percentage of calls did you receive before the premium rate number came into force that were nothing to do with VM equipment? What is the percentage now?
I would gamble that a large percentage of customers don't know whose equipment is at fault. They just go to use their broadband connection and discover there is a problem with it. They will telephone to try to get their problem solved just the same as they did before the premium rate number came in.
Is speaking to a customer a waste of your time? You appear to have a lot of spare time that you are using to post on CableForum. Perhaps in that spare time your Managers could get you answering some of the customer emails that never seem to be replied to.
we dont deal with the e-mails
seperate department, dont blame us for that m8
and how are we supposed to no percentages. lets just a lot... to a lot less
hokkers999
09-08-2007, 23:08
well, i dont think iv had any calls (and this is the genuine truth) where a customer has said,
"my broadband has been off for x numer of days days, but iv not call in because of the call charge/i thought id give it a chance to clear itself/i thought it was an issue on my side"
obv thats just me, i dont if other agent have
have also seen a large drop in the number of calls where a customer has got a router attached (most seem to be removing them before calling now im guessing) and most people do now seem to at least try rebooting the equipment (more do so now it would seem than did before when it was advised on the automated system to do so)
obviously no one likes being charged for a service, ecspecially one that was free for so long, but teh company have made the decision now and are going to stick by it. it is also agreed under icstis regulations that this is a fair charge being applied, otherwise vm would not be allowed to use this number and apply these charges
---------- Post added at 23:04 ---------- Previous post was at 23:01 ----------
okay, this comment really does annoy me a little bit
bringing some1 age and level of education into this is uncalled for, end of,
that is a terible insult to give anyone
he si on here expressing his personal opinion, on here you are not a customer and he he is not being paid by vm to come on here and offer advice, he does this as a member of the public just like you
vm employee or not he IS entitled to his opinion
Wrong again, whether on here or not I AM A CUSTOMER OF VM, and I also am entitled to my opinion.
Are you sure you are not being paid to be on here there was a thread earlier saying that "you" were posting *AT WORK* as it was quiet. Unless you clock off when you do so then I would keep quiet if I were you... :dunce:
why, we are aloud to browse the net between calls
i never said u werent entitled to you're opinion, all i said was so is vmtech... maybe you want to read my post again
and i am also a customer of vm... so i believe i am entitled to my opinion to
That's enough personal arguments. Both of you stop now.
Nedkelly
09-08-2007, 23:26
Just a thought remember when 150 was charged for after a while it went back to being free i wonder if this could happen to the support line in the future:)
In one way i dont agree with it but in a other way i do .Yes it will stop the stupid calls and let the peole with real problems get through .But i think the real problem is the refund of the call .I have been to some customers who have called this and yes it was vm fault and some did have the cost given back and some did not .It all depends on the agent :D
are you sure they didnt have the call cost credited and just hadn't been made aware it was credited. i no a couple of times at the beginning particularly, i forgot to inform them i was refunding but still did it.
and occasionally customers are so eager to get off the phone u dont have a chance to tell them! but they should b refunded if we're sending out a tech.
Nedkelly
09-08-2007, 23:37
To be honest i dont take much notice try not to get involved with billing matters .I fix the faults :)
lol, fair enough.
thats all your there to do
obv there will prob be a few occasions where credits aren't applied to account.
but hopefully cs should be able to sort this out, by matching up bills with notes left on the account, which should always state if credit should or shouldn't be given
Nedkelly
09-08-2007, 23:46
I tell them to call customer service as they can deal with it .Dont get me wrong i will try and help but sometimes they need to speak with someone with all the act details in front of them :)
what does a call to TS from a BT line cost??
the same 25ppm??
if its higher i suppose VM only refund 25ppm correct??
it is a little higher, im not sure on exact costs
we do only credit back at the rate to 25ppm, yes
brundles
10-08-2007, 11:06
have also seen a large drop in the number of calls where a customer has got a router attached (most seem to be removing them before calling now im guessing) and most people do now seem to at least try rebooting the equipment (more do so now it would seem than did before when it was advised on the automated system to do so)
Based on previous (admittedly pre-rip-off line) experience it made no difference how much of that I did before reporting the fault. The script monkey would still insist that was done again - because of course I'm not capable of unplugging a modem without tech support on the line to hold my hand :mad:. And the fact I'm looking at the modem status page and the logs are clearly reporting a fault must be my imagination.
we do only credit back at the rate to 25ppm, yes
And this is another gripe. I use a VOIP line as primary with mobile as backup because of the extortionate landline rates. Of course if there is a BB fault that means using the mobile to call VM tech support. What VM are effectively saying is "We will only refund the full cost of your call to report our problem if you pay us for a telephone line too". :mad:
And you need to learn that you never ever talk down to customers, you might have done it in school before they broke up last month but in the real world we will leave for another supplier and then you haven't got a job.
don't they teach anything in school nowadays - YOU CAN'T WIN AN ARGUMENT WITH A CUSTOMER.
Get that into your brain and you *MAY* have some sort of a future in tech support.
I dont talk down to customers if i done that i would be out of a job, i dont see what my age or when i left school has anything to do with any of this, if your going to argue with me argue with what i am saying not with the fact that am younger than you and only left school 1 year ago
---------- Post added at 14:13 ---------- Previous post was at 14:10 ----------
yes but thats they every1 does it most people refund for bt lines as most people have they but why would vm do that if they provied there own phone line, its not like they are breaking the law this is the way every premium line operate
Based on previous (admittedly pre-rip-off line) experience it made no difference how much of that I did before reporting the fault. The script monkey would still insist that was done again - because of course I'm not capable of unplugging a modem without tech support on the line to hold my hand :mad:. And the fact I'm looking at the modem status page and the logs are clearly reporting a fault must be my imagination.
And this is another gripe. I use a VOIP line as primary with mobile as backup because of the extortionate landline rates. Of course if there is a BB fault that means using the mobile to call VM tech support. What VM are effectively saying is "We will only refund the full cost of your call to report our problem if you pay us for a telephone line too". :mad:
my point was a lot of people didnt do this and it does resolve a lot of issues.
didnt say it fixed everything, its not a magic trick. just that it has increased the number of people attempting this before they call.
and vm arent responsible for mobiles and other networks charging at a higher rate.
7@m3 G33k
10-08-2007, 14:33
yes but thats they every1 does it most people refund for bt lines as most people have they but why would vm do that if they provied there own phone line
/grumpyoldfart
Exsqueeze me? Could I have that again in English or something vaguely Anglo-Saxon with a bit of grammar and punctuation? :erm:
/end grumpyoldfart
"yes, but thats the way every one does it, but most people refund for a bt line. why would vm do that when they provide the opton of a phoneline."
meaning vm take their phoneline as standard, whereas most companies take bt as standard.
7@m3 G33k
10-08-2007, 14:50
"yes, but thats the way every one does it, but most people refund for a bt line. why would vm do that when they provide the opton of a phoneline."
meaning vm take their phoneline as standard, whereas most companies take bt as standard.
Ta :)
he's just realised the error of his ways on that sentence
he just seen it on my screen
i have no idea wtf that sentence is meant to say.. when what and they must be put into a sentence in the proper order.. and at the proper times... posts on this forum seem to be making no sense recently... and are way off the SUBJECT of the original question..
a forum that is meant to be a question and answer has turned into a question .. argument .. oppinion .. flaming .. and spamming all in the same thread :S??
WTFs going on and im sure others would aggree
mabey Vmedia tech support employees shouldnt use this forum as it appears to be NO help what so ever to the people that are also using the forum.. as it sparks an argument..
Iv used this forum for years and never saw it like this.. so old im not even sure if my original username still works for it..
""STOPS USING FORUM""
Raistlin
10-08-2007, 15:14
i have no idea wtf that sentence is meant to say.. when what and they must be put into a sentence in the proper order.. and at the proper times... posts on this forum seem to be making no sense recently... and are way off the SUBJECT of the original question..
a forum that is meant to be a question and answer has turned into a question .. argument .. oppinion .. flaming .. and spamming all in the same thread :S??
WTFs going on and im sure others would aggree
mabey Vmedia tech support employees shouldnt use this forum as it appears to be NO help what so ever to the people that are also using the forum.. as it sparks an argument..
Iv used this forum for years and never saw it like this.. so old im not even sure if my original username still works for it..
""STOPS USING FORUM""
My Irony Detector just went into meltdown. I don't even know where to begin..........
I don't even think I can be bothered to explain..........
But you won't be reading this will you, 'cause you've left..........
Anybody seen the topic by the way?
i think that the most off topic post on here lainey
this thread was asking people to give their OPINION on the phoneline charge
there was nothing question and answer about it
and all people have been doing (for the main part is givin their opinions)
yes there has been disagreements, its part of life, and people will disuss and voice their opinions on this, its not always necessarily an arguement
and where is this spamming you are talking about?
<snip>Iv used this forum for years and never saw it like this.. so old im not even sure if my original username still works for it..
""STOPS USING FORUM""
Go give it a try. If it does work, I can promise you it won't for long. You do know that multiple IDs is against our terms of use don't you? ;)
emm lainey posting alot isnt spamming am fed up telling you that and if you cant express your oppinion whats the point in it then it would be boring if it was just questions and answers!
lainey just because we argue about stuff doesnt mean we dont help people if you have alook at some of the threads you would see that every1 contributes just because it breaks out in to an argument doesnt mean we dont help people
lol you tell him Chris T
Go give it a try. If it does work, I can promise you it won't for long. You do know that multiple IDs is against our terms of use don't you? ;)
:rofl:
Told you. :rolleyes:
LaineY just came up and told us he cant post anymore :erm:
wonder why? :rolleyes::p:
Ask him to respond to my PM. He'll find that should still work.
Back on topic now please.
lol will do, apparrently it wasnt funny lol(him saying that not me)
So we're two days in - there are 81 people voting for "not fair" and 16 voting for "fair".
Of those voting for, about a dozen of them work (from memory) for VM.
In addition I've only just noticed that the two most vocal people in the thread (who have voted in favor) work for VM in TS and are only 18 and probably don't even pay for their services*.
It's not looking good is it?
*probably live at home or if they do pay it'll be staff prices
Excuse me but we do pay for our services £1.50 a will have you know:P
What does our age have to do with any of this????????????????????????
I dont live at home my parents live in England
whats has age got to do with this?
does age or occupation stop us from being entitled to an opinion?
and not paying for our services?
staff still use the same number for tech support if we need details like e-mail/password/ or need a tech booked.
(we cant access our own account to do things like this)
i do agree with the phone charge on the basis of the crediting back, if we didnt id agree that it was a rip off.
I don't wish to talk on behalf of all the ex-18 yr olds who post on here, but if they (and the mods) will permit a little OT diversion, I think the reason you're getting so much emphasis from people on your youth is that they remember when they were 18, fearless, mouthy and (90% of the time) wrong. With respect, guys, I'm sure you are perfectly good at your jobs; diligent, responsible and reliable. However, many like myself who vaguely remember being 18, tend to remember how we thought we had the answers to everything and how utterly stupid we must have sounded to those around us with the advantage of years. Wisdom isn't generally given at birth, nor can you get a GCSE in it. It is acquired without knowing it and only after many years of getting stuff completely a**e-about-face.
The natural response of an 18yr old to a post like this is to go off on one. Please don't. It's not meant in a derogatory way, but more as a way of explanation. One day, you'll be an old fart like me and will be making the equivalent of posts like this in 20 yrs time to the then crop of 18 yr olds. When you do, have a little smile on my behalf :)
brundles
10-08-2007, 19:55
and vm arent responsible for mobiles and other networks charging at a higher rate.
Maybe not, but they are responsible for their network - and if it worked I wouldn't be making the call in the first place.
i'm not going to "go off on 1"
tho im sure you only mentioned that so if i did you could say "told you"
i dont think i have the answers to everything, i just feel regardless of my age i am entitled to my opinion, and i think it should be treated with at least a little respect
im not saying i have as much life experience as anyone on here, but that doesnt mean me or any1 else my age is automatically wrong. (and im not saying by this i am right, its only my opinion im expressing)
if people on here remember what it was like to be 18, maybe they should remember how s**t it feels have their opinion overlooked and be made out to be useless and stereotyped because of what SOME people out age are like
i do feel the call charge is fair, and i have explained my reasons for that already, i respect every1 elses opinions on why it's not, and can see where most points are coming from.
Yes you are probably 100% right about the whole 18 yearold.. "i dont care attitude" altho i will atmitt most of the 18 yearolds i work with ... or should i say.. including myself in this.. as im 21.. most of the under 21's i work with know how to do the tech support job inside and out.. and 1 million times better , quicker and more efficient than the people older than them do on the broadband tech support project for virgin media
because 9 out of 10 of the olders prefer to do it by the script.. which has was technically removed a year past.
i know how to do my job and yes i atmitt mabey sometimes i am wrong .. aswell as most of the agents on phones no matter what company they work for.
and 9 times out of 10 you will find its lack of communication
personally i think the center i work in has the most experienced people for a broadband tech job
but thats a personal oppinion...
Raistlin
10-08-2007, 20:28
Interesting though this whole age 'v' experience debate is, it's way off topic.
By way of (hopefully) having the last word on the subject, can I ask you to consider this:
As insidious as it is that people are judging other people on the basis of their age, they only know for sure how old you are if you enable that option in your profile. That said, I'm going to guess that (whilst they still might not have concrete proof) they would still assume that certain posters are around 18/19 based upon the way that they post.
Whether we like it or not, the way that we post/speak in any public environment says volumes about who we are. Attention to detail, properly formed statements, and obviously considered opinions, all tend to portray an image of maturity and experience. Poor spelling, lazy grammar, 'txt speek', hasty replies, and a propensity to see insult where none is intended, are often taken to be signs that the poster is either young or just generally immature.
It's an imperfect world that we live in, sometimes if you want people to treat you seriously you have to treat the way that you communicate with them seriously.
Anyway, apologies for that little off-topic rantette - perhaps this whole discussion is worthy of a thread of its own? Now, where was that topic again?
wow!! u got unbanned :shocked:
lol, as iv said, i dont disagree that 18years old are like that, i just disagree that i should automatically lumped into it by age
just like u get immature 30/40 year olds
there is a fair number of mature and responsible 18 year olds
and theres no reason to discount anyones opinion regardless of age or really maturity.
---------- Post added at 20:32 ---------- Previous post was at 20:30 ----------
sorry raistlin, there was no attempt there to get in the last work, i was already typin my reply when yours was posted
I wasnt banned i was under Sudation..:dozey:
But yeh i aggree on the 25p a min thing due to us (VM) taking responsibility for
our faults.. <network/modem/outage etc>
if its a pc fault then the call will be charged up to the 20 mins
Raistlin
10-08-2007, 20:35
and theres no reason to discount anyones opinion regardless of age or really maturity.
---------- Post added at 20:32 ---------- Previous post was at 20:30 ----------
sorry raistlin, there was no attempt there to get in the last work, i was already typin my reply when yours was posted
No worries, it's not me that anybody's got to worry about anyway - the Team will be around in a bit with the topic stick :D
Agree with what you say though, but in an arena like this all that people really see at first is the way that you post/conduct yourself. After a while they will get to see your experience and knowledge for what it is worth, and then things usually start to change :)
the Team will be around in a bit with the topic stick :D
/waves big stick.
Back on topic now please, any more off topic nonsense will be zapped.
whats has age got to do with this?
does age or occupation stop us from being entitled to an opinion?
In addition I've only just noticed that the two most vocal people in the thread (who have voted in favor) work for VM in TS and are only 18 and probably don't even pay for their services*.
I don't think age or occupation preclude you from an opinion but they do give an indicator towards why you have them.
Do you pay for your own services and phone calls?
Do you swallow the party line from work about how fair it is because you are lacking experience of employers feeding you rubbish?
Have you skimmed over the rest of the facts in my post because it's convenient?
Ultimately the two most vocal people in this thread that have been saying it's fair are both VM employers with little experience of how VM deal with their customers.
You're not the ones on the other end of the phone gambling on getting your 25p per min back. On past experience with VM in it's other guises I'm dubious of people getting their money back and reviews of the new scheme since it started aren't looking good.
This isn't about your age (or your occupation for that matter*)but it is a pointer to your likely reasons for thinking this new scheme is fair when most people don't. :)
*and I'm not trying to be patronising - I'm truly not
---------- Post added at 21:20 ---------- Previous post was at 21:16 ----------
wow!! u got unbanned :shocked:
lol, as iv said, i dont disagree that 18years old are like that, i just disagree that i should automatically lumped into it by age
just like u get immature 30/40 year olds
My comment on your age was never just based on your profile - as for the other poster I have him/her on Ignore as I just can't understand him/her
Like I said it wasn't about your age specifically but that your age was a pointer to why you thought it was fair.
Sorry Paul M - I've seen you post now - I'll move on. :)
as ive said though, we can quite easily be on the other end of the phone
if i need/forget my username password (as i have done jsut now and i will be phoning up for these)
if theres an outage in my area
if my modem packs in
i work on the telewest side and have ntl in the house
i have very limited access to systems which hold my details, and even if i did have access i wouldn't be allowed to
i am looking at this from both points of view
would i like to be able to phone up and get my username and password free - yes
is it vm's fault that i was careless and cant rmr - no
therefor valid charge and i wont even be asking for a refund
but if i do have to call in because m modems broke, or theres an outage not on the status line, i will make sure (in the same way any other customer does) that i get my refund
our managers dont drill into that this charge is fair, in fact, other than the short training we went through on how to deal with calls on premium rate lines i dont think its been mentioned by my managers to me. my opinion is entirely my own and isnt affected by others opinion.
but if i do have to call in because m modems broke, or theres an outage not on the status line, i will make sure (in the same way any other customer does) that i get my refund
And if it's a grey area - You know for sure that it's their fault but you can;t convice the agent that it is. What do you do then?
i'm trying to think when there would be a grey area :erm:
its normally clear
occasionally a cus will call up woth say intermittent connection when theyre online, and its hard to diagnose a fault at this stage, so we ask to call back when connections down to diagnose issue, but notes are left on call length,
so if its our issue we can apply a credit when probs diagnosed as being our end.
im struggling to think when there is any other grey area
occasionally you will get an idiot of an agent who'll get it wrong, but if you know hes wrong id just call, get another agent, get the prob diagnosed correctly and then get both call costs back.
Tech_Boy
10-08-2007, 22:00
The only time I cannot credit the customers account straight after the end of the call, is if the customer is a staff member, there is a different process for staff credits.
If there is a fault on our side, or the customer has been advised to call us in error, or if there is an account error that has caused a loss of connection. I credit the customer as soon as the call is finished, no ifs no buts ;)
Oh and I finished work 2 hours ago, I may have a forum window open in work, but I only read & reply to posts on my breaks.:angel:
ian@huth
10-08-2007, 22:07
It would appear from the poll that over 80% think that the 25p per minute charge is unfair. The VM techs that have been very vocal on here seem to think that using the premium rate line for broadband support has miraculously stopped customers from calling about problems that are not caused by VM. I think that time will tell a different story.
I would think that the majority of VM customers are not that technically minded. They go to use their broadband connection and it either works as expected or it doesn't. If it doesn't work as expected then they will assume that it is a problem caused by VM or VM's equipment. They will then either wait for a while to see if the problem goes away or they may call VM. If they decide to call VM there is a good chance that they don't know the premium rate phone number and try other numbers that they know or may have used in the past. They could try looking for online help on the Virgin Media site but that could be rather difficult if their broadband is playing up. I don't think that this type of customer will know if their problem is a VM issue or not and so will probably call just the same as they would have done before the premium rate number went live. The ones that do know the premium rate charges may very well be put off calling by their past experience of very long queues, offshore based support, script following support and the almost inevitable conclusion that the customers problem is caused by adware, viruses, operating system or the router they have.
What do the Virgin Media broadband support people who have been posting in this thread think is the reason for getting only a fraction of the calls that they used to get on the free number?
7@m3 G33k
10-08-2007, 22:22
i'm trying to think when there would be a grey area :erm:
its normally clear
occasionally a cus will call up woth say intermittent connection when theyre online, and its hard to diagnose a fault at this stage, so we ask to call back when connections down to diagnose issue, but notes are left on call length,
so if its our issue we can apply a credit when probs diagnosed as being our end.
im struggling to think when there is any other grey area
occasionally you will get an idiot of an agent who'll get it wrong, but if you know hes wrong id just call, get another agent, get the prob diagnosed correctly and then get both call costs back.
C'mon what? - I'm sure you're tired of reading my lengthy woes getting an e-mail response about my IMAP server query (I'm tired of typing about it!), would I have got a refund for that if I'd called? I think I should though I could see how it could be a 'grey area'.
Also check this (http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/12/33619168-ethernet-network-card-help.html) thread - another potentially grey area. There are plenty listed on the forum.
ok now i read enough of this thread i think ill say what i think
i do think a charge is fair
as it will stop people from calling in without checking thier own equipment 1st
people who have router/firewall/windows/hardware and other problems shouldnt be calling
VM TS
VM dont have obligation to make sure your PC and/or home network is running smoothly
your monthly payment doesnt include that
it might not be fair to people who doesnt know much about PC and didnt know where the problem lies
but still its not VM fault
with the refund
i think that they should make BT call cost the same 25ppm
dunno how they can do it but do think they can
so that BT callers can get the full call refunded
cause there are alot of people with BT landlines
and i guess the numbers are much higher then VM landline users (in UK)
even though i dont know the number of VM BB users that have BT landline
i do thnik theres alot
and maybe the charge is abit high
even though a VM tech said his average call time was like 5mins (cant remember who)
i would think there are calls that took much longer
and in the end realise it wasnt VM fault and the caller would be charged
maybe if they lower it abit
well of me calling in and be charged are slim
as i would of checked things at my own end before calling in
dunno how TS is nowadays
havent called TS for a year or 2
just hope they dont tell me to check for virus/spyware/restart PC
before actually do something their end
and please dont rant at me or flame at me
im only giving my opinion :P
also sorry voted No
but didnt know the facts then
would change to yes if im able to
7@m3 G33k
10-08-2007, 22:39
<snip>
and please dont rant at me or flame at me
im only giving my opinion :P
I thought ranting and flaming was the main point of forums?
Cheaper than therapy! :erm:
ian@huth
10-08-2007, 22:51
I just noticed a post in another thread by one of the broadband support agents who has been rather vociferous in this thread.yeah, on the ntl modems i think you do need to register them
think there is a site you can do it through (its posted somwhere on this forum)
and if it doesnt work i believe its tech support who register it
(though im not 100% sure so id wait on confirmation from someone else more upto date on the ntl modems and procedures)It makes you think, doesn't it?
i'm trying to think when there would be a grey area :erm:
its normally clear
Yet there are threads and threads where customers have been refused refunds but the fault isn't with their equipment. They get told it's their AV, spy-ware, OS - how can you prove otherwise?
That's why most people think it's unfair. It may actually be considered an illegal term under some legislation.
You may think it's ok but you're not the one calling the number and gambling that you'll get your fiver back.
---------- Post added at 23:32 ---------- Previous post was at 23:29 ----------
I credit the customer as soon as the call is finished, no ifs no buts ;)
Every time or just when you consider it's VMs fault?
If it's the former then VM will be dropping the line soon as it's costing them more than the 0800 number. If it's the latter then the same arguments stand :)
moaningmags
11-08-2007, 02:28
If in doubt, demand the agent call 2nd line and have them check for problems.
I regularly spar with them if I think I'm being fobbed off.
I just noticed a post in another thread by one of the broadband support agents who has been rather vociferous in this thread.It makes you think, doesn't it?
Maybe due to the fact that xntl use a different registration proces to the one What has been trained on for X TW
for those interested some of the Computer magazines offer a telephone Support Service you might get better help for the money contacting them first . many things seem to be Software related so worth a try there.
Tech_Boy
11-08-2007, 16:17
Every time or just when you consider it's VMs fault?
When it is a fault from our side.
evilmonkey
11-08-2007, 17:31
In the end the only people that think charges for 0906 numbers are fair, is the company charging for them. BT will be rubbing their hands together as BT phone line users get the money refunded to their VM account. In the end the point of a charge like this is to reduce people calling in. It doesn't reduce faults and does not mean people can all of a sudden make sense of the poorly designed help site. I'm sure long term people remember the change from 0800 to 0845 all it reduced was the people calling in saying their monitors or keyboards were no longer working. But its also a case of why should people pay 25ppm to call into a centre that runs the risk of getting an agent that simply runs through random fixes in the hope that one of them gets the connection working, or be told that spyware is causing their slow speeds because an agent can't properly interpret netstat.
Most people would not mind a charge for the support if they felt that they would always get a premium service for the premium price they were paying. But realistically you don't get a premium service for a premium price you get at best an 0845 level service. Not everyone is lucky enough to be heavily educated in computers and can not resolve their own faults even if it is just simply advice on how to secure your connection, and no PCG does not do a good job of that either as it most likely causes more callins than it prevents.
ian@huth
11-08-2007, 17:43
Maybe due to the fact that xntl use a different registration proces to the one What has been trained on for X TWThat may be so but what sort of support can agents give if they don't know anything about half the products they are supporting? And how can such an agent decide if the customer should have a refund for his call charges if the problem is with VM equipment that he doesn't know about or has been trained on.
When it is a fault from our side.
In your opinion?
i think alot of people are saying that
if we get incompetent tech on the phone
we might get charged and/or waste our time
but isnt this the case with all the other VM departments
not only VM but any other companys call centers
this board have loads of threads about incompetent customer support
with people having to phone CS hundreds of times (maybe abit exaggerated)
to finally get things fixed
and i heard of lots of other company useless support lines
to me
i think the policy is fine
but i dont know if VM techs are competent enough
not saying techs on this thread but as a whole
all companys must have a few incompetent staff not suitable for their positions
especially a company of VM size
Tech_Boy
12-08-2007, 01:27
In your opinion?
yup, 4 years 9 months on tech support with the company & several years pc building & repairing experience beforehand.
Georgy Porgy
12-08-2007, 15:16
just wondering who thinks the tech support call charge is fair or not
remembering that you only pay for the call if its your fault!
and theres nothing we can do to determine the call cost form other networks e.g. if your on bt theres nothing stopping you saying your on 1 that cost 75ppm
From the other thread we now have to pay even if it's not our fault. If they are carrying out trials or we are capped, and as we have no idea of either then there has to be legality issues in us being charged for the calls surely?
I had to call tech support yesterday after 4 reset's of my STB still prevented me from accessing my broadband internet. I was on for 15mins and calculated it at £3.85 - The guy took me through a few diagnostics (start -- run "inetwiz" & "cmd" to play ping)... at the end of it he said there was a major service downtime in my local area that was affecting local residents, and too wait a few hours.
Fair enough he promised me the charges would be reversed (I will be looking out for this on my next bill), but if that 0800 number for the status line had worked, instead of routing you back to the technical support queue - then I would have known there were problems with the network in the area.
Of course when you have no internet access, you can't go too www.cableforum.co.uk (http://www.cableforum.co.uk) to find out
to me the status line never really worked well for me
as i not really sure what area im supposed to be
i remember Southampton had problems which affected me
but sometimes Poole area comes up in the status line (which also affected me)
so should i be under the area of Southampton aswell
as its the larger city around my area??
sorry realise im going abit OT
hey, iv missed a couple of days of posts on this and other threads and i really cant b bother readin thro pages on all of them to catch up (i no its laziness but im not on for long tonite either, so if there was any posts direted at me that you would like me to answer to, please repost.
anyway, on this page i have noticed that the convo has switched to the status line. not all problems are put onto the status line, just the big ones. as at any1 time there is 10 or sometimes or more problems goin on that will b affecting speed for 3/4 people, or causing short service loss for a few people.
these problems aren't listed on the status line for obvious reason, so just because there is only a problem listd in for example southampton, and then you are told there is a problem in your area, its not always goin to be that one that affecting you. i would say, if theres is a problem, listed on the status line and it is relatively near to u, or you know you are in that area, dont call 0906. the major problems (the ones listed on the status line, are normally same day/ latest next day resolve) if there is no problems listed, or none near you and you call tech support and they say theres a problem, ask if its the one listed on the status line. (we have notes of this) i'm hopin my ops manager doesnt read this as he has seen some of my previous posts, but if a customer says he wasnt aware he was in the area on the status line, or he didnt hear that problem, or wasnt aware of the status line i give them credit for the call. (because the company should have worked harder to inform the cus of the status line (tho im sure occasionally they will lie im a trusting person))
and if you ask then you'll know whether to listen out for the issue on status line / whether you will be able to continue calling 0906 for updates (with all calls credied)
JB001D7606
12-08-2007, 19:27
I've had quite a bit of trouble with my pc lately and no matter what you think - you have no option but to ring that number if you want your problem solved. One such call from me last week got to 20 minutes when the guy said "I'll have to stop there - but I'll ring you back right away" He did and the problem was further discussed at Virgin's cost. Hope that helps to lesson the pain? regards harford
yup, 4 years 9 months on tech support with the company & several years pc building & repairing experience beforehand.
Which must mean you're never wrong - right?
Tech_Boy
13-08-2007, 11:36
Which must mean you're never wrong - right?
That would be very conceited of me, no I'm just saying that I have been here a while.
That would be very conceited of me, no I'm just saying that I have been here a while.
It's those instances where even the best techs get it wrong that is the bug bear for most - a small error on their part leads to a big (unwarranted) bill on the customers part.
not really if a tech spots a mistake by another tech we credit the cust back, were are these "grey areas" its ethier virgins fault or the customers fault and we have no problem admitting its virgins fault a dont really care whos fault it is to be honest if a can get the cust back online or at least tell him how to or when he will then am happy, the 0800 number cant transfer you to tech support all it can do is give you the number
mrmistoffelees
16-08-2007, 10:14
not really if a tech spots a mistake by another tech we credit the cust back, were are these "grey areas" its ethier virgins fault or the customers fault and we have no problem admitting its virgins fault a dont really care whos fault it is to be honest if a can get the cust back online or at least tell him how to or when he will then am happy, the 0800 number cant transfer you to tech support all it can do is give you the number
This is you isn't it ??
http://images.businessweek.com/ss/06/09/popular_toys/image/teddy_ruxpin.jpg
This is for Broadband only, most of the times you can resolve it yourself.
Well in my case anyway, that includes rebooting the modem, installing router again, etc.
If I could pay up to £5 to get an agent who I could understand (newsflash company execs - there is a reason why Indian call centres are completely unpopular!), who knew what they were talking about and would either fix the problem with me over the phone, or say "yes there's a service fault in your area" or "you need an engineer appointment - let's get you one booked" then yes, I will pay up and call up and get stuff fixed relatively happily.
On the other hand - paying £5 to speak to some person in India who may be a lovely person, but can't understand what I'm saying (and I don't have a strong regional accent - just the remains of a few years up in the North East), and has the great solution of turning the power off on the modem then tell me it's a Windows problem and I need to phone Microsoft and slamming the phone down on me - is not acceptable. Yes, that is quite regularly the level of tech support I've recieved from India - even when you tell them that, yes before I called you I've spyware and anti-virus scanned, reset the modem, checked all cabling is plugged in correctly and I'm running a completely standard Windows box with nothing obscure on it.
To be honest - if call volumes have gone down - it's because the service on the end of the tech support line can be so shockingly bad at times, that nowadays people just don't bother calling in and coping with some of the utter fob-off tosh that we get handed out. It's discouraging genuine fault calls from ringing in as well as the people like my mother who would do something like the cd-tray cup holder thing that's well known. Charging with the express intent of using this as a means to reduce the number of tech support calls - isn't this the equivalent of sticking their heads in the sand to pretend that the faults with their network aren't happening?
For what it's worth - I used to work for a well-known electric company that took the decision to move their call centres back away from India because things just were not working out and it was antagonizing too many customers. Perhaps Virgin needs to think about doing the same thing for the more technical parts of the business such as broadband tech support - particularly when they're demanding a premium rate to call in with the great Virgin lottery of will you get your calls refunded or not? At the very least keep the calls that are going to India to straight-forward account administration type ones that there's less potential for disaster with the communication issues.
all companys must have a few incompetent staff not suitable for their positions
especially a company of VM size And this is unacceptable to consider this a good state of affairs, especially when customers are being charged a sizeable amount of money now to call in (and hope it gets refunded). If there are these incompetent techies around (and by heck there are) then Virgin needs to buck up its monitoring proceedures in order to get them rooted out and retrained - not just sit back and say "oh yes we have some bad apples just ring back and hope you get a different agent."
If the "support" i got was classed as support, i might not mind paying it.
But to be told by some guy 100's of miles away, who i'm struggling to understand, and then to be told its spyware\router\anti-virus\time of the month thats caused my loss of broadband, i dont think so.
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