Branded as liars and cheats? [Archive]

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NetfrogUK

05-08-2007, 02:42

I believe that when someone doesn't tell the whole truth then they should be branded LIARS

VIRGIN MEDIA....BROADBAND MANAGERS...MUST TELL Customers & their support staff THE WHOLE TRUTH
about THEIR NATIONWIDE...MAJOR BROADBAND DOWNLOAD SPEED PROBLEMS.

I've never had the speed I've paid for & when I was getting .78 Mbps for 10 Mbps I just put up with it.
BUT moving to 20 Mbps & only getting an average of 2.3 Mbps THAT'S a RIP OFF

Despite weeks & weeks of being politely fobbed off from one person to another.& two engineer visits.
I want Virgin to tell the truth & admit to Customers & their support staff that they have a major download speed problem or be branded as LIARS & CHEATS.

It is just not good enough to hear a voice message on 0800 561 0061
from Page 6 - step two of the "Virgin Broadband Set-up Guide"
or be referred to the 25p per minute PLUS 10p connection charge SUPPORT SERVICES

When you have a problem you want solutions/answers
NOT "We are aware that some of our customers are having speed problems... etc"

Friday last week a new modem was fitted & after re-connect by a support expert in "India" he said I had a download speed of 18 Mbps BUT I've constantly averaged daily speeds of about 2.3 Mbps for the last two months or so...his comments annoyed me & he talked to me like I was three year old child.

I then spent 33 minutes explaining this to a Virgin CUSTOMER CARE person (complaints dept) BUT I only managed to shift his repeated suggestion to call tech support again to clarify my speed when he finally accepted "Virgins download speed problem" when he heard the Voice message on 0800 561 0061

His final suggestion was that I downgrade until the download speed problem has been resolved. BUT of course I want what I have paid for.

Ask your wife/partner what they would say if they put Ã‚Â£2.30 worth of food @ the checkout & were charged Ã‚Â£20.
Imagine putting a Ã‚Â£20 note in the petrol machine & only getting Ã‚Â£2.30 in the tank.
or getting no change for a Ã‚Â£2.30 rail ticket after inserting Ã‚Â£20

YES Mr Branson & it's all in your name.

After another long conversation with the CEO office I got emailed the following...with...an attached <<Optimisation for 20 Mbps Speeds.doc>>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for speaking with me earlier. You are certainly not the only person who is experiencing variable performance from a 20mb connection. We have examples of this issue from all over the country, and whilst the numbers a relatively few, the subject is of great concern to us. Extensive investigations are taking place, however, the numbers of variables involved are making the resolution more difficult than we would like.
To help you effectively and for us to gain more understanding about your situation, we really need more specific information regarding download speeds, latency and pc configuration. I have checked your modem logs and capacity/contention at your local ubr and would rule out those elements as a cause of any problems at this stage.

here are the download links we suggest you can use to test your download speed:

http://freebsd.virginmedia.com/ISO-IMAGES-amd64/6.2/6.2-RELEASE-amd64-docs.iso

ftp://mirrors.blueyonder.co.uk/mirrors/ftp.freebsd.org/ISO-IMAGES-amd64/6.2/6.2-RELEASE-amd64-docs.iso ....

any data you can provide me with relating to actual download speeds will be very useful, I need to know the speed achieved and also the time of day the download takes place. Also, you my like to try and download the same file three times over and add together the combined download speeds for total transfer rate?

In the meantime, may I ask you to read the attached document regarding optimization of the tcp/ip settings for Windows. A significant number of customers are seeing huge improvements in stability and download speeds when using the optimization suggestions we are making. We believe these optimizations are necessary and desirable, but would like to point out that if you decide to use them it must be at your own risk and we recommend that you back up any important data and set a restore point on the computer before applying any changes. Please repeat any download test after optimization to assess any changes or improvements gained

We assure you of our best attention at all times
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I got an average of 2.3 Mbps...from the two downloads above....At least it's a benchmark for all to try & compare)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
PS...Trying to get "speed problem help" on the Virgin Media Customer site is also very frustrating
Navigating the site is like searching through "a forty gallon drum of worms".

This is the 21st Century & Virgin Media SITE MANAGERS cannot have any excuses.
BECAUSE they are are acting like real virgins...inexperienced & lacking.in certain areas.

Hurdy

05-08-2007, 10:15

Just tried your links and I don't get more than 78KB/sec...

alferret

05-08-2007, 10:30

With those links my speed sits at 488KB\sec after 2 minutes.

Could it be that there is a problem with your machines, IE: a router that struggles with higher speeds, god forbid you have some spy\ad ware on your machines.

Everything isnt all VM's fault.

Hurdy

05-08-2007, 10:35

Brand new modem, brand new router - spyware lol...

My connection was fine at 10MB.

checker

05-08-2007, 10:40

Download speed 13.8Mbs for me using the link mentioned. Could be better I know. Perhaps they are only liars and cheats in certain geographical areas?:bigcry:

alferret

05-08-2007, 10:49

Brand new modem, brand new router - spyware lol...

My connection was fine at 10MB.

Dont knock the comment m8, you'll be supprised just how many people have poorly PC's and blame VM for their slowness, and thats a fact.

Angua

05-08-2007, 10:56

Strange thing is (apart from when the green box overheats) we are on 4mb and generally get around Test 1: 1024K took 2562 ms = 399.7 KB/sec, approx 3294 Kbps, 3.22 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 2360 ms = 433.9 KB/sec, approx 3575 Kbps, 3.49 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 2250 ms = 455.1 KB/sec, approx 3750 Kbps, 3.66 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 5093 ms = 402.1 KB/sec, approx 3313 Kbps, 3.24 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 3483 Kbps, 3.4 Mbps
and this is probably the slowest for a long time. :shrug:

xpod

05-08-2007, 11:06

14480

Not toooo bad down here in cock-a-knee land today:)

Dont knock the comment m8, you'll be supprised just how many people have poorly PC's and blame VM for their slowness, and thats a fact.

It certainly is:)

EDIT:
Sun, 05 Aug 2007 10:07:07 GMT

Test 1: 1024K took 1131 ms = 905.4 KB/sec, approx 7460 Kbps, 7.29 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 1098 ms = 932.6 KB/sec, approx 7685 Kbps, 7.5 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 878 ms = 1166.3 KB/sec, approx 9610 Kbps, 9.38 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 1905 ms = 1075.1 KB/sec, approx 8859 Kbps, 8.65 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 8404 Kbps, 8.21 Mbps

According to a download of course

iTekweni

05-08-2007, 11:14

With those links my speed sits at 256KB\sec after 2 minutes my kit has not changed or been altered and with 10meg my downloads were far faster than what I am experiencing now.

but I am now resigned to these speeds and being ripped off

ntluser

05-08-2007, 11:21

I downloaded the file from the Blue Yonder site and it was fascinating to watch how the download speed varied considerably from second to second.

It's clear from this that not only is the connection not reaching the advertised speed it's also not a stable speed.

Pity that there is not a independent organisation who can monitor speeds and deal with companies that do not provide the service advertised.

alferret

05-08-2007, 11:30

snip!
but I am now resigned to these speeds and being ripped off

You do not need to be resigned to these speeds or to be ripped off, downgrade your service.

---------- Post added at 11:30 ---------- Previous post was at 11:25 ----------

I downloaded the file from the Blue Yonder site and it was fascinating to watch how the download speed varied considerably from second to second.

It's clear from this that not only is the connection not reaching the advertised speed it's also not a stable speed.

Pity that there is not a independent organisation who can monitor speeds and deal with companies that do not provide the service advertised.

Thing is, all ISP's advertise that they provide and "up to" service and that there are no guarantees that you will receive the speed you subscribe to. That said if you pay Ã‚Â£37 for a 20mb service and at best you only get 1\10th of that speed regardless of the STM then you need to look at alternatives and also to see if there are underlying problems that are not on the VM network, like your PC, bandwith hogs next door etc.

xpod

05-08-2007, 11:34

but I am now resigned to these speeds and being ripped off

You should`nt resign yourself to anyhing my friend......that is what these companies hope you`ll do and if they have enough people thinking like that then losing a few along the way certainly wont make no odd`s.

If your consistently getting a lesser service than that which you pay for you should really be doing something about it.

Never "resign" yourself to anything in life:)

EDIT:
I downloaded the file from the Blue Yonder site and it was fascinating to watch how the download speed varied considerably from second to second.

Mines did go up & down like a yo yo too funnily enough...that was just as high as it went but it was constantly going up & down from 10Mb to what it is in the screenie:(

Paul

05-08-2007, 11:36

As always, the problems only exist in some areas, not all.

For instance, I Tested mine this morning ;

Sun, 5 Aug 2007 10:27:11 UTC

Test 1: 1024K took 438 ms = 2337.9 KB/sec, approx 19264 Kbps, 18.81 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 437 ms = 2343.2 KB/sec, approx 19308 Kbps, 18.86 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 438 ms = 2337.9 KB/sec, approx 19264 Kbps, 18.81 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 906 ms = 2260.5 KB/sec, approx 18627 Kbps, 18.19 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 19116 Kbps, 18.67 Mbps

At absolute full speed I would expect this to be about 19Mbps so its fine - and No, I don't always get such good results, it can slow down at busy periods, but that is to be expected.

I wonder how many BT/SKY/whatever (ADSL) customers get their advertised 8/16/24 Mbps ?

Raistlin

05-08-2007, 11:48

Just to throw my couple of pence into the hat, and to side with Paul M (<shudders> ;) ).....

I'm on Plus Net and very rarely get the speed that's quoted as my 'full' or 'maximum' speed, and you know what? It really doesn't bother me.

I get my maximum speed most of the time off-peak, and occasionally during certain times of the day, during other times of the day I get a useable browsing speed which is fine for general Internet and email.

If I want to download huge files, or run torrents, I do so during the wee hours of the morning (by using a bit of software to schedule the downloads for me) and they're done and available when I get up in the morning.

Sure, it's a pain in the rear some times, but the sun's shining and there really are far worse things happening to much nicer people than me in this world.

I'm off to get a beer and chill in the garden in a little while, maybe when I get beck my speeds will be faster than they are at the moment, maybe they won't - I'll certainly be better lubricated, and slightly less lucid though :D

---------- Post added at 11:48 ---------- Previous post was at 11:46 ----------

:LOL: Just ran the test, looks like my speeds are ok at the moment :)

Sun, 05 Aug 2007 10:48:20 GMT

Test 1: 1024K took 2080 ms = 492.3 KB/sec, approx 4057 Kbps, 3.96 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 1913 ms = 535.3 KB/sec, approx 4411 Kbps, 4.31 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 1985 ms = 515.9 KB/sec, approx 4251 Kbps, 4.15 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 5156 ms = 397.2 KB/sec, approx 3273 Kbps, 3.2 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 3998 Kbps, 3.91 Mbps

Sun, 05 Aug 2007 10:48:44 GMT

Test 1: 1024K took 1949 ms = 525.4 KB/sec, approx 4329 Kbps, 4.23 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 2228 ms = 459.6 KB/sec, approx 3787 Kbps, 3.7 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 1636 ms = 625.9 KB/sec, approx 5157 Kbps, 5.04 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 3735 ms = 548.3 KB/sec, approx 4518 Kbps, 4.41 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 4448 Kbps, 4.35 Mbps

Angua

05-08-2007, 11:50

A well balanced attitude Raistlin :tu:

Raistlin

05-08-2007, 11:51

A well balanced attitude Raistlin :tu:

Well balanced? Possibly slightly less well so after a few beers in the sun :beer:

ntluser

05-08-2007, 11:59

The irony is that if you get a speed of, say, 264 Kbps, it satisfies the " upto " requirement for the 2Mb,4Mb,10Mb & 20Mb service but users are all charged differently.

Normally, people would downgrade but though the price decreases the quality of service does not improve.

In my case, I recently signed up for the Ã‚Â£85 VIP package so downgrading is not an option unless I want to fork out more money which I don't have.

I used to pay Ã‚Â£100 a month to Virgin but when Sky & Virgin had their disagreement and the Sky channels were lost I waited three months for them to resolve it. When that didn't happen ( and didn't look like happening!!) I opted for the VIP package and used the Ã‚Â£15 saved to buy the cheapest Sky package.

Hopefully, the complaints from Virgin Customers to OfCom might get things moving. Failing that a takeover and a fresh injection of new capital for network development might benefit staff, customers & shareholders alike.

ECW_Original

05-08-2007, 12:24

Just to clear up a few things, THERE IS a problem with the 20mb servers, I have been told by a "senior engineer" but having said that, there is only a handful of "upto" 20MB customers that are having problems, well this is what I was told 3 months ago, and was assured it would be sorted out soon, still, typical VM!

If it was legal, Id be connecting to other people's wireless networks!!!

handyman

05-08-2007, 12:35

I wonder how many BT/SKY/whatever (ADSL) customers get their advertised 8/16/24 Mbps ?

My Sky 8mb ADSL:erm:
Sun, 5 Aug 2007 11:33:49 UTC

Test 1: 1024K took 8625 ms = 118.7 KB/sec, approx 978 Kbps, 0.96 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 8640 ms = 118.5 KB/sec, approx 976 Kbps, 0.95 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 8641 ms = 118.5 KB/sec, approx 976 Kbps, 0.95 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 17250 ms = 118.7 KB/sec, approx 978 Kbps, 0.96 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 977 Kbps, 0.96 Mbps

xpod

05-08-2007, 13:03

The last thing i think i`d do would be to sign up with someone else instead.
I like my cable bb regardless of how slow it ever gets....after all it`s not as if 4Mb is`nt a perfectly useable amount.

Which is besides the point of course.:)
If anything i reckon i probably picked the best of a bad bunch(only bunch) and i do know from friends,family & neighbours that the likes of Tiscali & Sky are certainly no better........for overall problems that is and not just stupid bb speeds.

RizzyKing

05-08-2007, 13:14

Still waiting to get 20mb though reading so many threads about it has dampened the wait for me. I am on 10mb now and my speed fluctuates between 1.2 and 8.5 constantly does not seem to be any stability with the connection at all. Before someone trots it out my pc is very secure has no spyware\adware and does not have any viruses or trojans of any sort i check on a daily basis.

The Hitman

05-08-2007, 13:59

When I download off news groups I get 18.8Mbps/2.3MBps. So i get the full wack. BUt when i download off websites it varies. So the problem is at their end not mine

Kindra

05-08-2007, 14:32

I also did your link test and got 2.03MB/sec. I have the (so called) 20meg connection and I tried this speed test http://www.numion.com/YourSpeed3/Select.php?Country=gb&Language=English&Top100=0 , and I got :-

Download speed: 19,045.29 (2,380.66) 96%
Upload speed: 722.29 (90.28) 97%
Surfspeed inside United Kingdom: 1,160.14 (145.01) 100%
Surfspeed average (worldwide): 375.57 (46.94) 95%
Surfspeed outside United Kingdom: 302.10 (37.76) 95%
Latency: 78 milliseconds

I'm not clue'd up with all the MBps, Mb/sec Kbps ect so not sure on link test if thats correct. should it say 20MB/sec ?

thx
K..............

Sirpingalot

05-08-2007, 14:40

vmtech

05-08-2007, 14:41

just because the routers new doesnt make it able to handle 20mb, most of the slow speeds problems we get are because of routers and ppls pc, dont get me wrong virgins not perfect far from it but the are alot better than the other providers out there a pay for upto 8mb on bt and have never got above 100kbps on any download

handyman

05-08-2007, 14:50

I've always liked ntls/telewest's/virgin's cable modems because of the simple ethernet presentation and the way this offers you complete control over which router/switch or wireless router you connect it too. Also if something does go Pete Tong you don't have to be faffing about with phones and master sockets.

Sirpingalot

05-08-2007, 14:51

Daffy Duck

05-08-2007, 15:57

When I download off news groups I get 18.8Mbps/2.3MBps. So i get the full wack. BUt when i download off websites it varies. So the problem is at their end not mine

I would say that shows the problem isn't at VM's end.....if it was you wouldn't get full speed from newsgroups either.
Your newsreader probably makes multiple connections to the news server and that enables it to max out your connection.When you're d/loading from a website you probably don't have as many connections to it and are unable to max it out,and thats assuming the site in question can even upload to you at 20 meg in the first place....many can't.

vmtech

05-08-2007, 16:19

yeah if you can get it from newsgroups then your connections there

goldoni

05-08-2007, 16:54

Hi NetfrogUK and :welcome: I like you I am suffering with speed and browsing issues and yes it was after the upgrade. I have suffered the Indian call centres I have even been able to speak to a person in Wales and another in customer relations they have all relented to confirm I do have a problem in my area and they donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t have a date when it will be fixed.

My broadband works of sort ie I can upload to my web sites, I can now send and receive email and I can view the www albeit a little slow, my ping speeds are total rubbish for a 20Mb/s connection

I donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t think for one moment that VM staff are liars and cheats because they work in a very competitive market place and they could loose their market share at the drop of a hat if what you are saying was true. What I do know there are many Ã¢â‚¬Å“customersÃ¢â‚¬Â who do have problems their end ie a certain Linksys router can only handle 10Mb so if you say are using that router you not going to get more than 10Mb/s That is only one of the many problems the end users will have.

If youÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re concerned regarding your current charges I will lend you my MK1 leaching tool and no doubt like me you will get a good deal from the retentions dept and they will confirm until they sort the problem you will only be charged for the 4Mb/s connection, but thatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s not my place to say.

Hope this post doeÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s not sound condescending because I did not intend it that way. :angel: :Peaceman:

bayonet

05-08-2007, 18:17

Ok here's the test from Robin Walker

Sun, 05 Aug 2007 17:09:43 GMT
1st 128K took 187 ms = 700920 Bytes/sec = approx 5832 kbits/sec
2nd 128K took 141 ms = 929589 Bytes/sec = approx 7734 kbits/sec
3rd 128K took 187 ms = 700920 Bytes/sec = approx 5832 kbits/sec
4th 128K took 125 ms = 1048576 Bytes/sec = approx 8724 kbits/sec
Not so good on 20 meg

NUMION confirms this as 6.2 meg download and 717 upload

Not had speed this bad for a while might be maintenance this morning was getting near the 20 meg

This from VM server status page for all areas

today's maintenance
no maintenance scheduled for today

And now this..............what????????

Sun, 05 Aug 2007 17:44:58 GMT
1st 128K took 47 ms = 2788766 Bytes/sec = approx 23203 kbits/sec
2nd 128K took 63 ms = 2080508 Bytes/sec = approx 17310 kbits/sec
3rd 128K took 47 ms = 2788766 Bytes/sec = approx 23203 kbits/sec
4th 128K took 62 ms = 2114065 Bytes/sec = approx 17589 kbits/sec

themelon

07-08-2007, 08:23

As always, the problems only exist in some areas, not all.

For instance, I Tested mine this morning ;

At absolute full speed I would expect this to be about 19Mbps so its fine - and No, I don't always get such good results, it can slow down at busy periods, but that is to be expected.

I wonder how many BT/SKY/whatever (ADSL) customers get their advertised 8/16/24 Mbps ?

Probably about 10 lucky people who live in the exchange!! Im pretty sure that percentage wise far more people will be getting close to advertised speeds on cable than they are on ADSL. Most people ive spoken to who have ADSL seem toget lower speeds than 6Mb ive never actually known anyone 'face to face' who has got a faster speed. You read on the forums that some people with the correct conditions get 18Mbs or something but ive never seen it in practice. Also at work we have 7 branches with 8Mbs eclipse ADSL Lines and the max speed we get is around 1.9Mbs in any of them, quite a few of the branches are in large towns fairly close to exchanges. What annoys me about ADSL the most is when it drops a connection and does always come back on automatically, or when you have to reset about 15 times to get it working. On ringing support you have to faff around with stupid filters unplug all the telephones, move you computer next to the master socket. How annoying....ive never had such troubles with cable. Currently still on 10Mb and getting 9Mb, hopefully the upgrade never comes :)

Still no excuse really........something does need to be done about advertising speeds that can not be delivered from ALL providers.

vmtech

07-08-2007, 14:51

why would you want the most people are getting the full 20mb, me being 1 of them:)

AntiSilence

07-08-2007, 14:55

I've just found your links (didn't see the post originally). Tried one and got this download speed:

vmtech

07-08-2007, 15:15

there you theres another person