View Full Version : Legal Action Against Virgin Media
andyr2005
07-03-2007, 14:09
Hi,
I am just posting this cause I am in the process of starting legal proceedings against Virgin Media, basically, I have been paying for the 10MB broadband service since July 2006, and since then have had nothing but problems. I have since been made aware, that a problem was reported on the UBR I was connected to in June 2006, and since then, to this present date has not been checked/repaired or upgraded, yet I have had several engineers out to my house and re-wire the premises and even change my modem as I was always told it was down to a fault on my end.
After this time, and many many complaints sent to Virgin Media's head office, and no responses, I am now going to under take legal action under their own Terms and Conditions and Code of Practice, both of which they have broken since I joined their service back in July 2006. At the end of the day, I am doing this not only for myself, but it seems that Virgin are so contempt at breaking their own rules, and providing the customer with lac-luster services.
Please, let me know of any problems and the length of time you have been suffering, just so I can get some more information on this, as it seems the only way to get something done, is for someone to take legal action and give them a swift kick in the balls.
Thanks, Andrew Robinson.
you plan to take a multi-billionaire to court?
Well Done ;) someone who Hate Virgin Media. :tu:
Graham M
07-03-2007, 14:42
lol
andygrif
07-03-2007, 14:47
To be quite honest, I think you're possibly on a hiding to nothing. If the service is as bad as you claim, cancel your services in writing, giving 30 days notice, citing the reason for your cancellation and find a supplier which better meets your needs.
You're unlikely to find anything in their company's T&Cs that you can claim against, the best hope you have if you really wanted to engage in legal action would be to contact your local Trading Standards office, OFCOM and the DTI.
The only way to recover some of your expenditure would be to have documented actaul speeds available to you for the period you're referring to (so for example if you were paying £35 per month for 10mb and you were getting something like 2mb which is worth £25 per month) then you could issue a claim against them for the £10pm for each of the months - but this would be very difficult to prove.
There is usually a clause in your contract stating that they do not guarantee speeds and/or connection.
To be quite honest, I think you're possibly on a hiding to nothing. If the service is as bad as you claim, cancel your services in writing, giving 30 days notice, citing the reason for your cancellation and find a supplier which better meets your needs.
You're unlikely to find anything in their company's T&Cs that you can claim against, the best hope you have if you really wanted to engage in legal action would be to contact your local Trading Standards office, OFCOM and the DTI.
The only way to recover some of your expenditure would be to have documented actaul speeds available to you for the period you're referring to (so for example if you were paying £35 per month for 10mb and you were getting something like 2mb which is worth £25 per month) then you could issue a claim against them for the £10pm for each of the months - but this would be very difficult to prove.
There is usually a clause in your contract stating that they do not guarantee speeds and/or connection.
And he had already had a reduction in price, re his post 15/12/2006
I was having the same problems a copule of weeks back, started July 06 even though I'm on a 10MB line I was getting roughly just about 1MB. Rather than get constant refunds, ask the have the problem escelated to either service delivery or the CEO's office.
After doing so myself, they offered me several ways to keep me, and assured me that they are aware of the problems, and are working hard to resolve them. They offered me a free 10MB connection for the remaining 7-8 months of me contract, and also when the problem was resolved I received a bill for rougly £180, which they very kindly withdrew, and I was not billed that month ;).
Hi,
I am just posting this cause I am in the process of starting legal proceedings against Virgin Media, basically, I have been paying for the 10MB broadband service since July 2006, and since then have had nothing but problems. I have since been made aware, that a problem was reported on the UBR I was connected to in June 2006, and since then, to this present date has not been checked/repaired or upgraded, yet I have had several engineers out to my house and re-wire the premises and even change my modem as I was always told it was down to a fault on my end.
After this time, and many many complaints sent to Virgin Media's head office, and no responses, I am now going to under take legal action under their own Terms and Conditions and Code of Practice, both of which they have broken since I joined their service back in July 2006. At the end of the day, I am doing this not only for myself, but it seems that Virgin are so contempt at breaking their own rules, and providing the customer with lac-luster services.
Please, let me know of any problems and the length of time you have been suffering, just so I can get some more information on this, as it seems the only way to get something done, is for someone to take legal action and give them a swift kick in the balls.
Thanks, Andrew Robinson.
I personally use a Giganews Diamond Account (Unlimited with SSL) and have never had any speed issues." said andyr in december
what a difference two months make :dozey:
AndyCambs
07-03-2007, 15:39
And he had already had a reduction in price, re his post 15/12/2006
I was having the same problems a copule of weeks back, started July 06 even though I'm on a 10MB line I was getting roughly just about 1MB. Rather than get constant refunds, ask the have the problem escelated to either service delivery or the CEO's office.
After doing so myself, they offered me several ways to keep me, and assured me that they are aware of the problems, and are working hard to resolve them. They offered me a free 10MB connection for the remaining 7-8 months of me contract, and also when the problem was resolved I received a bill for rougly £180, which they very kindly withdrew, and I was not billed that month ;).
But that states when the problem was resolved... so presumably there is no problem now?
---------- Post added at 15:39 ---------- Previous post was at 15:28 ----------
I personally use a Giganews Diamond Account (Unlimited with SSL) and have never had any speed issues." said andyr in december
what a difference two months make :dozey:
Looks like his case is bound to fail then - as he can't claim there has been "nothing but problems"
Hmm i can smell something and its not pleasant, sorry mate you havent got a leg to stand on.
I just hope you get legal aid, youre gonna need it ;)
I must ask the million dollar question, if you are soo disatisfied with the service you are receiving why not just cancel and go to another provider?
Are you thinking "GIGANEWS + 20MB Upgrade in June" by anychance? :D
No linux ISO's download there then :Yikes:
No linux ISO's download there then :Yikes:
;)
AndyCambs
07-03-2007, 16:47
Hmm i can smell something and its not pleasant, sorry mate you havent got a leg to stand on.
I just hope you get legal aid, youre gonna need it ;)
I must ask the million dollar question, if you are soo disatisfied with the service you are receiving why not just cancel and go to another provider?
Are you thinking "GIGANEWS + 20MB Upgrade in June" by anychance? :D
I don't think you'd get legal aid for this..
andyr2005
07-03-2007, 17:32
And he had already had a reduction in price, re his post 15/12/2006
With respect to that, yes, I got 1 refund, for the month after the issue was resolved. After that, standard billing and 2 weeks after, issues began yet again, and to be honest, when you phone TS, you get sick and tired of them telling you the same bull about high TX load and utilisation issues, especially at 1 in the afternoon, when most people are at work.
But that states when the problem was resolved... so presumably there is no problem now?
Original problem re-occured after roughly one month of it resolution, and to be quiet honest, why should any customer have to put up with it for roughly 6 months before any action is taken?
Looks like his case is bound to fail then - as he can't claim there has been "nothing but problems"
Incorrect,
Faulty broadband for rougly 8 out of 10 months, faulty phone service, when calling mobiles from land lines, I get the message from the mobile network I am calling saying I have insufficient funds, and 4 STB's have been replaced cause of faults. Also, they rewired my house which in the end fixed nothing cause I and they knew it was nothing to do with that, as a company they just don't want to admit they have a problem, and don't want to resolve it.
With respect to everyone else, I was asking anyone if they have any problems with their service, not for bickering wether or not I will get legal aid etc.
I think its fair to say that some folks do get service problems, but honestly, take some sound advice.....get out if the service is that bad, and go to another supplier. Court action will cost YOU a hell of a lot more than you think, and I have to agree with the other poster, you'll be on a hiding to nothing.
I see absolutely no grounds for any legal action here at all. You would be wasting your time and a lot of money in court fees.
As already pointed out by several posters - There are clauses which specifically state that the 10Mb service is not sold 'as is' - in other words, it's sold 'Up to 10Mb' and there are no guarantees for a consistant speed of 10Mb.
I bet the lawyers are rubbing their hands, they will be the only winners!
If things are so bad, cancel and walk away and enjoy the rest of your life.
andyr2005
07-03-2007, 18:22
Hi,
Why don't you guys just take a look at what they are actually giving customers for the money they pay, they expect customers to pay for 10MB and get no more and 1MB at times during the day, roughly 1 in the afternoon, and expect you to believe the bull**** story of that being caused by high TX load, I mean, yeah fair enough, that might be the problem at night, but not during the day, when most people are at work.
At the end of the day, your responses to wether or not I should take legal action are irrelevant, I have spoke to Trading Standards and Ofcom, who both recommended I contact a goverment run organisation called CISAS, which is a similar organisation to Ofcom, but they can take any legal action required to resolve on going issues a communications customer is having.
Tell you what, whoever the mod is, you might as well delete this thread, cause people just dont seem to read the original post anyways, and jump straight to conclusions.
Also, you guys might actually want to take a read of the Code of Practice yourselves.
When a customer signs a contract with a company, the customer is legaly bound to the contract, as is the company to which the contract is being signed, therefore, and break of the contract from either side, can have legal consequences.
In this case, Virgin Media are bound by the contract, and their Code of Practice as stated in the contract. For example you dont pay on time etc, what do they do, they restrict service, apply charges etc. So what happens, when you keep to your side of the contract and they dont?
Absolutely nothing, there is no organisation or body in place to covern this, which in honesty is pathetic, and no way to run a company.
If nothing constructive is going to be posted, then don't post.
Admin, up to you, delete or lock this thread, cause it will turn into a flamming match, I bet!
you cant walk away and enjoy the rest of your life and cancel your services , becuse your with them for 12 months.i do have problem with mine and told me they can Not fix my problem so i told them if it ok if i cancel my services they said yeah no problem but need to pay 280.00 !!!:mad:
andyr2005
07-03-2007, 18:35
you cant walk away and enjoy the rest of your life and cancel your services , becuse your with them for 12 months.i do have problem with mine and told me they can Not fix my problem so i told them if it ok if i cancel my services they said yeah no problem but need to pay 280.00 !!!:mad:
At last, some one who actually may understand what I am on about, as he stated, to walk away you have to pay a cut-off fee, which if they don't provide the services, originally signed for in contract, legally you cannot be held to.
At last, some one who actually may understand what I am on about, as he stated, to walk away you have to pay a cut-off fee, which if they don't provide the services, originally signed for in contract, legally you cannot be held to.
But as you are not appearing to understand, there are clauses which state that the service that is provided is not guaranteed. So if you are using the service / signed such a contract, you have agreed to this.
Now if you was on a business tariff you would have a point because there is usually service level guarantees applied.
make an official complaint, if they do something great, if they dont then leave another complaint and switch to a different isp.
andyr2005
07-03-2007, 19:11
So,
Lets put this to a different perspective,
You go and pay for a Ferarri, few days later you go to collect it, yet you find it's a Ford Fiesta, so you take it, leave your money and try somewere else to get a Ferarri, cause thats basically the perspective you guys are putting on this.
You mean these http://www.arbitrators.org/CISAS/guidance_notes.asp
Cannot see how they can fine someone.
I agree that, if I was in OP's position, I'd rather invest the energy in getting my internet from elsewhere but ...
There are clauses which specifically state that the 10Mb service is not sold 'as is' - in other words, it's sold 'Up to 10Mb' and there are no guarantees for a consistant speed of 10Mb.
Virgin obviously have to provide some basic level of service. I'd be surprised of the contract does not have a 'get out' clause for the customer if Virgin cannot provide a decent level of service. (Sky's contract does, for example). Companies cannot hide behind unfair terms of contracts anymore.
But again, it appears the OP has received some compensations thus far..
cookie_365
07-03-2007, 19:36
I don't think you'd get legal aid for this..
I know some of the Legal Aid people in Newcastle - they'd have a field day with this one if he was daft enough to apply ;)
Don't want to sound harsh - but complain, see if they make you a good offer, if they don't end the contract as soon as you can and explain to them why.
If your contract isn't up, you can risk walking away and cancelling your DD - but you may find yourself up in court having to demonstrate to a District Judge that they didn't complete the contract if they take out proceedings.
of course , you dont need Legal Aid , as thats what the N1 and small claims court is all about......
its not exactly hard to take companys or anyone else for that matter to county court, see the bank charges as an example of how...
andygrif
07-03-2007, 20:33
At the end of the day, your responses to wether or not I should take legal action are irrelevant,
So why bother courting them then?
I have spoke to Trading Standards and Ofcom, who both recommended I contact a goverment run organisation called CISAS, which is a similar organisation to Ofcom, but they can take any legal action required to resolve on going issues a communications customer is having.
CISAS is an arbitration service which can act as an intermediary between customer and service provider when an agreement cannot be reached. Given that both trading standards and OFCOM seem unable to assist you in your greivance, it might be worth considering that the nature of your greivance does not put your service provider outside of any code of conduct or consumer law.
Tell you what, whoever the mod is, you might as well delete this thread, cause people just dont seem to read the original post anyways, and jump straight to conclusions.
I find that statement quite offensive. You posted your problem, people replied on the basis of the information you gave. If the answer is not what you're after then either you didn't post all the information needed to get everyone on your side, you don't really have a case or to most rational people the case would not be worth following-up on.
When a customer signs a contract with a company, the customer is legaly bound to the contract, as is the company to which the contract is being signed, therefore, and break of the contract from either side, can have legal consequences.
What part of their contract are you claiming they are in breach of? And why?
If nothing constructive is going to be posted, then don't post.
Mr Pot...meet my friend Mr Kettle.
At last, some one who actually may understand what I am on about, as he stated, to walk away you have to pay a cut-off fee, which if they don't provide the services, originally signed for in contract, legally you cannot be held to.
So you're now saying that you're in the first 12 months of your contract are you? You didn't mention this before.
Even so, if you can prove that your service level has fallen below the expectations set by the provider, then you would under consumer law have a case to cancel the contract as they could be described as not fit for purpose. But clearly your trading standards office doesn't agree.
I would also imagine that if you put Virgin on notice, ie in a letter stating your problem and that if the problem is not solved in seven days, sent via Registered Post to the Company Secretary then they would release you from the contract early and you can get on with your life.
yeh but if i was paying for a (upto) 10mb connection i would expect it to reach 10 meg now and then and not operate as upto 2meg connection! good luck andy! ;)
AndyCambs
07-03-2007, 21:29
From your posts on here, I don't think quite honestly you should waste the bus fare going to court.
WHISTLED
07-03-2007, 22:05
What a load of rubbish.. Dont even entertain him with discussion. Same old rubbish again and again and again..
NTLVictim
07-03-2007, 22:12
Ok, just a guess..4 undeclared VM employees on this thread.
gazzzman
07-03-2007, 22:15
lets hope he signs up with SKY broadband;)
so far the reliability has been so good amongst my customers...
well lets just say I have had no e-mails complaining er actually I have got no e-mails from them at all for some reason lol!!!:D
They offered me a free 10MB connection for the remaining 7-8 months of me contract, and also when the problem was resolved I received a bill for rougly £180, which they very kindly withdrew, and I was not billed that month ;).
My word, FREE 10Meg connection for 7 - 8 months of your remaining time on contract, and waived a £180 bill.
Seems you got rather a good deal there.
Is this the reason you dont want to jump ship and leave VM? because of all these good deals you get? ;)
Looking at this guys previous threads, there are some things that just dont add up.
AndyCambs
07-03-2007, 22:18
lets hope he signs up with SKY broadband;)
so far the reliability has been so good amongst my customers...
well lets just say I have had no e-mails complaining er actually I have got no e-mails from them at all for some reason lol!!!:D
And of course, not forgetting that Sky's upto 8MB broadband will probably only give you around 1MB....
NTLVictim
07-03-2007, 22:27
Make that six..
Ok, just a guess..4 undeclared VM employees on this thread.
Plus 1 Sky Troll :D
andygrif
08-03-2007, 01:15
And of course, not forgetting that Sky's upto 8MB broadband will probably only give you around 1MB....
Do you ever say anything constructive?
AndyCambs
08-03-2007, 04:21
Do you ever say anything constructive?
That is constructive.
It's pointing out that you're less likely to get the "promised" 8MB with ADSL rather than the 10MB with Virgin Media.
andygrif
08-03-2007, 10:11
No it isn't. You said that you'd probably only get 1mb of the 'up to' 8mb offered. And if you take what the O/P says verbatim and quite a few other posts on here, the 10mb from Virgin seems to be suffering too.
But that wasn't my point Andy. I very rarely see you enter into (IMHO) sensible discussion. Instead you throw in random insults, snide remarks and when confronted with real facts you go quiet or move on to another snide remark in reply to something else said.
Have you stopped to consider that this could be quite rude?
...it's sold 'Up to 10Mb' and there are no guarantees for a consistant speed of 10Mb.
Has this ever been tested in a court of law?
Would a publican sell beer in volumes of "up to one pint"?
Has this ever been tested in a court of law?
Would a publican sell beer in volumes of "up to one pint"?
LOL, I love the way people throw around words such as "court" and "law" when most here have little or no idea what they are actually talking about.
No ISP in their right mind would provide a contract guaranteeing that their customers will always get the advertised speed. And if any do, then they have no idea how the Internet works, and should not be trusted to offer such services, no matter how attractive the offer seems.
Please guys, move on, this has been done to death.
Mick Fisher
08-03-2007, 10:40
ISP's generally have been getting away with blue murder with all this upto crap for far too long.
It's about time that a firm definition of what is acceptable service is included in the TOS and is referred to, in readable print, in the advertising.
If it's gonna take a court case to achieve this then I for one say "Go for it"
ISP's generally have been getting away with blue murder with all this upto crap for far too long.
It's about time that a firm definition of what is acceptable service is included in the TOS and is referred to, in readable print, in the advertising.
If it's gonna take a court case to achieve this then I for one say "Go for it"
I'll second that :tu:
georgepomone
08-03-2007, 11:52
Hi All,
I've read through the posts with interest.Even the bit about the beer.I can remember arguments about that when lined glasses first came in.The argument there was could you call froth a part of the measurement up to the line.Best to leave that one.
If I could see some success in taking ISP's to court to clarify just what is expected from the customers point of view I can see that would be a good thing. Trouble is I don't think you would get any recompense for the money it would cost to take it to court.
Without taking logs etc, the ISP would always find a way round what is complained about.We all know that when we ring most ISP's they usually blame it on something from the customers end because it's a way of not taking ownership of a fault.It's a sad fact that what is promised and what is provided are not always the same thing.
When I ring about a fault, like a lot of people on here I have already checked things out at my end. It's not always the case that a customer has done this. Some customers wouldn't know what to do anyway. Because of this the ISP's can sometimes if not all the time get round a complaint by saying it's the customers equipment at fault.
The way things are at the moment I can't see any quick change to this situation.
Still we can dream.
George.
...No ISP in their right mind would provide a contract guaranteeing that their customers will always get the advertised speed. ...
So you would be happy if an ISP advertised "speeds up to 100Mb (see Terms and Conditions)", even if this could only be achieved by sitting in the company's headquarters?
Most of us understand that advertised speeds cannot be guaranteed, just as trains cannot guarantee to run to their published timetables. But if a train company consistently failed to meet its own published standards, shouldn't a revised timetable be released?
So you would be happy if an ISP advertised "speeds up to 100Mb (see Terms and Conditions)", even if this could only be achieved by sitting in the company's headquarters?
Most of us understand that advertised speeds cannot be guaranteed, just as trains cannot guarantee to run to their published timetables. But if a train company consistently failed to meet its own published standards, shouldn't a revised timetable be released?
Don't dissagree with you, my point was aimed at those who think that LAW and COURT and LEGAL actually mean that ISP's will sit up and listen. They have created cast iron contracts. You don't think that VM pay thousands to legal teams so they can design contracts that wouldn't hold up to legal scrutiny in terms of the service they offer, do you?
Vote with your wallets by leaving, don't waste your money and time on court cases you will never, EVER win.
ISP's will sit up and listen if they start to lose large sums of money because their service is crap. And unlike the train system, you do have a choice of suppliers in most regions.
...Even the bit about the beer.I can remember arguments about that when lined glasses first came in.The argument there was could you call froth a part of the measurement up to the line....
Personally speaking, I never did mind if the beer was just above the line or just below it. I would have complained, however, if the glass was only 20% full...
......The way things are at the moment I can't see any quick change to this situation. Still we can dream....
Well, George, I dream about a levy on every broadband customer of, say, 10p per annum. For VM alone this would generate £300,000, to be paid towards a regulatory organisation responsible for testing the claims made by ISPs in real-life situations. An independent "actual expected speed" could then be published, similar to the APR used for loans.
LostintheNW
08-03-2007, 12:51
What a load of rubbish some people are spouting in this thread, and its all too common those who have no knowledge of the law spout words as "small claims" etc and do a quick google search and think they know it all!
You have no grounds to go to court, the services are up to 10mb, not guaranteed 10mb 24/7, if it said that you would have grounds, but as their T&C's state if the service does not meet the requirements you are allowed to cancel.
Seeing as you have taken their offers of a free service, reduced price etc you don't even have a leg to stand on if you decided to report them of OFCOM for not supplying a service.
I take it that seeing as you are off to court regardless of what people say in this thread you have proof of the speeds you have been getting for the past 8 months, can prove what times of day you are getting poor speeds, have all the cable modem logs, and did you tell the CS people when you were engaging them in a phone call that this would be recorded or used in evidence in court? as if not you can't refer to any of these calls unfortunately. Again you are going to need more proof than you can glean from your little modem logs.
Get over yourself, if you are that unhappy you should have said when they offered you refunds, free services etc that you do not want these and instead want out of your contact, as basically you have got this anyway seeing as you are not paying for the service. So instead of moaning on here about the service you are getting for free, ring up another ISP and get them installed and use them instead, you are not paying anything extra!
Some people think the world owes them everything, and to whoever that prat is posting on about undeclared VM staff I will point out I do not work for Virgin Media, never have never will and that I have my law degree and work in a nice law firm :)
has no one ever heard of a "bakers dozen" and why the bakers dozen was used lol. the isp's certainly havent lol
xspeedyx
08-03-2007, 14:32
Makes me laugh
Spooky_uk
08-03-2007, 16:24
What a load of rubbish some people are spouting in this thread, and its all too common those who have no knowledge of the law spout words as "small claims" etc and do a quick google search and think they know it all!
You have no grounds to go to court, the services are up to 10mb, not guaranteed 10mb 24/7, if it said that you would have grounds, but as their T&C's state if the service does not meet the requirements you are allowed to cancel.
Seeing as you have taken their offers of a free service, reduced price etc you don't even have a leg to stand on if you decided to report them of OFCOM for not supplying a service.
I take it that seeing as you are off to court regardless of what people say in this thread you have proof of the speeds you have been getting for the past 8 months, can prove what times of day you are getting poor speeds, have all the cable modem logs, and did you tell the CS people when you were engaging them in a phone call that this would be recorded or used in evidence in court? as if not you can't refer to any of these calls unfortunately. Again you are going to need more proof than you can glean from your little modem logs.
Get over yourself, if you are that unhappy you should have said when they offered you refunds, free services etc that you do not want these and instead want out of your contact, as basically you have got this anyway seeing as you are not paying for the service. So instead of moaning on here about the service you are getting for free, ring up another ISP and get them installed and use them instead, you are not paying anything extra!
Some people think the world owes them everything, and to whoever that prat is posting on about undeclared VM staff I will point out I do not work for Virgin Media, never have never will and that I have my law degree and work in a nice law firm :)
the law is an ass. proven. :)
andyr2005
08-03-2007, 16:35
My word, FREE 10Meg connection for 7 - 8 months of your remaining time on contract, and waived a £180 bill.
Seems you got rather a good deal there.
Is this the reason you dont want to jump ship and leave VM? because of all these good deals you get? ;)
Looking at this guys previous threads, there are some things that just dont add up.
Right, as stated earlier, this one-off bill payment was made yes, however, the rolling credits have stopped. At the end of the day, they offered me this in my opinion to shut me up and sort of by my silence on the matter.
LOL, I love the way people throw around words such as "court" and "law" when most here have little or no idea what they are actually talking about.
No ISP in their right mind would provide a contract guaranteeing that their customers will always get the advertised speed. And if any do, then they have no idea how the Internet works, and should not be trusted to offer such services, no matter how attractive the offer seems.
Please guys, move on, this has been done to death.
The LAW is the contract which is a legally binding document between 2 or more entities, and either entity to break the legislations within such a document is liable to have legal action taken against them.
Right,
The other thing, I have just had a call from my Trading Standards office, who have been in touch with a high-level complaints team at VM, and have actually found them to be in breach of their Code of Practice which governs their ability to actually provide the services of the market they are in.
I have been told, that if the situation is not resolved in 7 working days, then Trading Standards will take any further action required, due to the fact that their have broken their own agreement.
If people have nothing constructive to say, say nothing and I will post back as often as I get updates from my Trading Standards office.
prawncocktail
08-03-2007, 16:40
which ubr are you on may i ask
andyr2005
08-03-2007, 17:05
Hi,
I believe I am on UBR 1, Northeast Gateshead.
What a load of rubbish some people are spouting in this thread, and its all too common those who have no knowledge of the law spout words as "small claims" etc and do a quick google search and think they know it all!
You have no grounds to go to court, the services are up to 10mb, not guaranteed 10mb 24/7, if it said that you would have grounds, but as their T&C's state if the service does not meet the requirements you are allowed to cancel.
Seeing as you have taken their offers of a free service, reduced price etc you don't even have a leg to stand on if you decided to report them of OFCOM for not supplying a service.
I take it that seeing as you are off to court regardless of what people say in this thread you have proof of the speeds you have been getting for the past 8 months, can prove what times of day you are getting poor speeds, have all the cable modem logs, and did you tell the CS people when you were engaging them in a phone call that this would be recorded or used in evidence in court? as if not you can't refer to any of these calls unfortunately. Again you are going to need more proof than you can glean from your little modem logs.
Get over yourself, if you are that unhappy you should have said when they offered you refunds, free services etc that you do not want these and instead want out of your contact, as basically you have got this anyway seeing as you are not paying for the service. So instead of moaning on here about the service you are getting for free, ring up another ISP and get them installed and use them instead, you are not paying anything extra!
Some people think the world owes them everything, and to whoever that prat is posting on about undeclared VM staff I will point out I do not work for Virgin Media, never have never will and that I have my law degree and work in a nice law firm :)
ROFL ,your so funny LostintheNW :D
you make the statement about your UK? 'law degree' and imply to the readership your degree is in consumer contract law/Civil Law(i.e generic consumer T&C text) but dont seem to have read the current T&C and so have seen several clauses there that are open to question.
did you forget your oath ?,
"The oath states: "I (Member’s Name), do swear that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth, Her Heirs and Successors, according to Law. So help me God."
The affirmation states: "I (Member’s Name), do solemnly, sincerely and truly declare and affirm that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth, Her Heirs and Successors, according to Law.""
while i am the only one so far to mention 'small claims' so you apparently are refering to me, in the 'spouting words', 'google search'
and in your opinion 'think they know it all'.
ill just point out it is you that is spouting your elitist 'MY law degree'
and how that somehow makes you better than the average reader here.
its interesting to note however that given the average peoples willingness to learn, and in doing so might use google or any other form of reference to gain insight and true facts as related to a given subject, they dont usually feel the need to spout elitist dogma.
"Please note that Roman Law/Civil Law, Conflicts of law and Notarial Practice are not usually studied on a standard law degree course or in the course of training to become a solicitor or barrister, hence most applicants will need to study these subjects. It is of course open to any applicant to seek exemption from these subjects too, should they have the relevant experience. "
http://www.thenotariessociety.org.uk/more_notaries.asp
as the holder of your (whatever?)law degree, is it not your place to take your clients claim/court action and place that before the court (to the best of your ability?), and its the courts and the magistrates/judges place to determine IF the client has a case OR NOT,and rule on that, not yours.
interesting that even judges, use reference books to look up the law as they are wise enough to realise they can not ever know all there is to to know about the given subject..., but perhaps your special and you have a photographic memory. :dunce:
Right, as stated earlier, this one-off bill payment was made yes, however, the rolling credits have stopped. At the end of the day, they offered me this in my opinion to shut me up and sort of by my silence on the matter.
The LAW is the contract which is a legally binding document between 2 or more entities, and either entity to break the legislations within such a document is liable to have legal action taken against them.
Right,
The other thing, I have just had a call from my Trading Standards office, who have been in touch with a high-level complaints team at VM, and have actually found them to be in breach of their Code of Practice which governs their ability to actually provide the services of the market they are in.
I have been told, that if the situation is not resolved in 7 working days, then Trading Standards will take any further action required, due to the fact that their have broken their own agreement.
If people have nothing constructive to say, say nothing and I will post back as often as I get updates from my Trading Standards office.
So, what do you expect to be a satisfactory resolution within 7 days. Given as you say that you have not had a full 10Mb service since 2006, what miraculous change in 7 days can you, and the trading standards consider acceptable?
Have the trading standards folks quoted exactly what part(s) of VM's code of conduct they have breached?
andyr2005
08-03-2007, 17:47
They did not quote to me exactly what part of the Code of Conduct has beem breached, which is why I am letting them deal with the situation. As stated previously, I will update on any futher information I get from. I beleive trading standards would take a satisfactory resolution to be VM attempting to resolve the situation I and many other customers are having. As well as begin operating as their own agreement states they will.
As for the Up to 10 MB baloney alot of you are spouting, I don't expect 10 MB all the time, I understand networks can have issues, but the point of fact is, that the problem I and many customers in the North East are facing have beem persistent for roughly more than 9 months now, with no mention of a resolution or even any investigation into the problem. I pay for 10 MB so therfore I would expect any speeds from 4 MB upwards, considering 4 MB is the package below, however, I get bairly over 1 MB, which correct me if I am wrong, but currently isn't offered in any service package via cable.
Well, assuming of course your continued poor speeds can be verified and many others in the North East, I really can't see what a breach in their code of conduct has to do with their network, but as you rightly say, you will inform us if you have more information you wish to share.
Incog bookmarks this thread.Will try to remember to come back 6 months down the road and prod for an answer.:)
andygrif
08-03-2007, 18:07
To be fair, if a company says that speeds are not guarateed in their T&Cs but then advertises and sells an 'upto 10mb' service then it could be seen as misleading to consumers if that product did not reach that speed or close to it.
But we know that VM's 10mb can and does reach 10mb, so clearly there is an issue with this connection. So under consumer law it could be argued that the product was not fit for purpose - which might be grounds to convince someone at Virgin with a little applied common sense to allow what is clearly an unhappy customer out of their 12 month agreement.
What the O/P hasn't said is what he wants the outcome to be.
1. Does he want it fixed?
2. Does he want an early exit?
3. Does he want to downgrade to a service that works for him?
1. As I have already said, write a letter to the company secretary saying so, sending via registered mail putting them on notice that he wants it fixed in the next seven days. Give an outcome if the company fails, such as reserving the right to end the contract early, as the product is not fit for purpose.
2. Again, as said, if you can find someone with a little common sense, usually by politely working your way up the escalation order in the call centre you might find that they will allow you to be released from your contract. If not, again, registered mail, company secretary, stating reasons and giving 30 days notice.
3. This should be the first one I guess; if you're only getting a 1mb service then what happens if you donwgrade to a 1mb service rather than paying for the 10mb service, (although I'm not clear if you're still getting the 10mb service for free or not).
Realistically you are not going to take them to court, you have no grounds to as you have no losses - but you can get the problem solved.
Assuming you want to.
LostintheNW
08-03-2007, 19:10
ROFL ,your so funny LostintheNW :D
you make the statement about your UK? 'law degree' and imply to the readership your degree is in consumer contract law/Civil Law(i.e generic consumer T&C text) but dont seem to have read the current T&C and so have seen several clauses there that are open to question.
did you forget your oath ?,
"The oath states: "I (Member’s Name), do swear that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth, Her Heirs and Successors, according to Law. So help me God."
The affirmation states: "I (Member’s Name), do solemnly, sincerely and truly declare and affirm that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth, Her Heirs and Successors, according to Law.""
while i am the only one so far to mention 'small claims' so you apparently are refering to me, in the 'spouting words', 'google search'
and in your opinion 'think they know it all'.
ill just point out it is you that is spouting your elitist 'MY law degree'
and how that somehow makes you better than the average reader here.
its interesting to note however that given the average peoples willingness to learn, and in doing so might use google or any other form of reference to gain insight and true facts as related to a given subject, they dont usually feel the need to spout elitist dogma.
"Please note that Roman Law/Civil Law, Conflicts of law and Notarial Practice are not usually studied on a standard law degree course or in the course of training to become a solicitor or barrister, hence most applicants will need to study these subjects. It is of course open to any applicant to seek exemption from these subjects too, should they have the relevant experience. "
http://www.thenotariessociety.org.uk/more_notaries.asp
as the holder of your (whatever?)law degree, is it not your place to take your clients claim/court action and place that before the court (to the best of your ability?), and its the courts and the magistrates/judges place to determine IF the client has a case OR NOT,and rule on that, not yours.
interesting that even judges, use reference books to look up the law as they are wise enough to realise they can not ever know all there is to to know about the given subject..., but perhaps your special and you have a photographic memory. :dunce:
I am sorry you appear to have typed that with your ass, where do I imply my area of work is contract law? as its not consumer or civil law that is actually in question, i suggest you go away and read what I actually put.
And I claim to be elitist with my law degree? where again did I actually put this in fact?
Sorry but if the T&C's were in anyway ambiguous then they are not legally binding and therefore anyone can walk away - somehow I doubt NTL/Telewst/Virgin Media (add any other company plus ISP here) would allow the same kind of terms to be in their contracts as they wouldn't stand up in a court of law if anyone was to actually try and sue on them.
But sorry what do I know, nothing according to you - oh and sorry but google away and see exactly what you find, perhaps you should read the fountain of all knowledge on wikipedia as it appears thats where you have your knowledge from.
Thanks for making me laugh, brightened up my day after a hard slog in the office.
When I had serious and I mean serious BB problems, I sent what could be called a polite email to Stephen Carter who was the CFO at the time I believe. He had his personal assistant contact me and the whole issue was sorted within a couple of days. I received a refund for the months I was without a service and a large discount for 12 months. The fault took a little longer to fix as it was not a localised problem, but once it was sorted out I have never looked back on the BB front. I honestly believe that for BB, Virgin cannot be beaten.
I would try the polite letter route before the legal one, I remember a year or so back when a lawyer sued Tiny computers for selling him a dodgy plasma, it was resolved but it took a long long time and probably lots of money.
Just my view.
Setch
prawncocktail
09-03-2007, 11:22
Hi,
I believe I am on UBR 1, Northeast Gateshead.
hmm, interesting, i am in the same area as you but i dont seem to have the problems you have, i regularly get 10mb as do many people i know...
Hello all, just a view from someone who's been dealing with courts for years (and I'm not claiming to be an expert in anything, so that saves me re-taking my exams on this forum)
I think there are some reasonable arguments on both sides here, and some universal truths - like the only people who will really benefit (financially) are the solicitors, should this go to court, whoever runs it - trading standards etc.
As an observation, I get the feeling that there's an element of "If you don't like it move on" and all this talk of terms and conditions feels pretty defeatist.
Yes I'm sure Virgin Media et al have paid some very expensive solicitors to write their terms and conditions, which customers do indeed sign up to. I'm also sure that the major high street banks paid some expensive solicitors to draw up their terms and conditions, which a lot of us signed up to also. Yet now we see hundreds (if not more) of people reclaiming the charges imposed upon them by the banks, as they have now been deemed to be unreasonable.
The point I'm making is that just because something is in the terms and conditions and just because you signed up to them doesn't always mean you're on a hiding to nothing. Because something is in the terms & conditions it doesn't make it right (beyond reproach) and so therefore is not always a fait accomplis.
For me it's about:
A customer has signed up for 10mb but consistently getting 1mb.
Now we can (and have) go all around the houses arguing about how much evidence there is/needs to be and how much Virgin Media have done to compensate the customer. That's a matter to consider if pursuing an action.
For me it's all about reasonableness. Is it reasonable for a customer paying for (up to) 10MB to expect to get close up to 10MB on a consistent basis. I think so.
Is it reasonable for a business to provide a tenth of the service they led you to believe you'd get (and the advertising does influence this expectation) and then claim that it's OK because it's covered in the T&C's. I really don't think so.
For me, you have to think in terms of the type of service being offered when it comes to the T&C's. Mission to mars - it's fairly reasonable to include you might not come back in one piece. Whilst providing BB no doubt has it's troubles (hence the 'up to'), it's not an untested science or a risky mission and therefore one can expect to pretty much get what you pay for. If you don't you should be able to get redress from the supplier.
I whole heartedly agree with the friendly method of resolution (letter/calls etc) and tend to think this would resolve the matter. Virgin knows the real cost of negative publicity and to be fair may really want to resolve the issue anyway.
That said, if they don't/won't resolve it, should we as customers challenge that or simply accept it was covered in the T&C's. Personally I'd challenge it.
There have been lots of things in history that have been legal. Attitudes change and so does the law.
Hope you get a satisfactory resolution. :)
Mick Fisher
10-03-2007, 15:52
Hello all, just a view from someone who's been dealing with courts for years (and I'm not claiming to be an expert in anything, so that saves me re-taking my exams on this forum)
I think there are some reasonable arguments on both sides here, and some universal truths - like the only people who will really benefit (financially) are the solicitors, should this go to court, whoever runs it - trading standards etc.
As an observation, I get the feeling that there's an element of "If you don't like it move on" and all this talk of terms and conditions feels pretty defeatist.
Yes I'm sure Virgin Media et al have paid some very expensive solicitors to write their terms and conditions, which customers do indeed sign up to. I'm also sure that the major high street banks paid some expensive solicitors to draw up their terms and conditions, which a lot of us signed up to also. Yet now we see hundreds (if not more) of people reclaiming the charges imposed upon them by the banks, as they have now been deemed to be unreasonable.
The point I'm making is that just because something is in the terms and conditions and just because you signed up to them doesn't always mean you're on a hiding to nothing. Because something is in the terms & conditions it doesn't make it right (beyond reproach) and so therefore is not always a fait accomplis.
For me it's about:
A customer has signed up for 10mb but consistently getting 1mb.
Now we can (and have) go all around the houses arguing about how much evidence there is/needs to be and how much Virgin Media have done to compensate the customer. That's a matter to consider if pursuing an action.
For me it's all about reasonableness. Is it reasonable for a customer paying for (up to) 10MB to expect to get close up to 10MB on a consistent basis. I think so.
Is it reasonable for a business to provide a tenth of the service they led you to believe you'd get (and the advertising does influence this expectation) and then claim that it's OK because it's covered in the T&C's. I really don't think so.
For me, you have to think in terms of the type of service being offered when it comes to the T&C's. Mission to mars - it's fairly reasonable to include you might not come back in one piece. Whilst providing BB no doubt has it's troubles (hence the 'up to'), it's not an untested science or a risky mission and therefore one can expect to pretty much get what you pay for. If you don't you should be able to get redress from the supplier.
I whole heartedly agree with the friendly method of resolution (letter/calls etc) and tend to think this would resolve the matter. Virgin knows the real cost of negative publicity and to be fair may really want to resolve the issue anyway.
That said, if they don't/won't resolve it, should we as customers challenge that or simply accept it was covered in the T&C's. Personally I'd challenge it.
There have been lots of things in history that have been legal. Attitudes change and so does the law.
Hope you get a satisfactory resolution. :)
:clap:
Web-Junkie
12-03-2007, 13:07
Well put that man clarkey!
I would also like to point out this statement from the VM website here:
http://allyours.virginmedia.com/fairplay/faq.html
OK, this is about the Sky fiasco but this quote is interesting:
An award-winning broadband on cable service that's 4 times faster than Sky's service. Plus, it's reassuringly reliable and lets you download as much music and movies as you like.
Now how can it be reassuringly reliable when in the evening some areas speeds are like a yoyo? I suffer the same problems here in the NG17 area as other people in other areas with poor speeds in the evenings, so clarkey has a point as the service is not reassuringly reliable and should be addressed! If it was reassuringly reliable we wouldn't be seeing these problems with 10mb!
Would a publican sell beer in volumes of "up to one pint"?
There's legislation for that, measures Act or something. So the measure is taken away from the contractual terms and stipulated by Statute. Unless a similar Act exists for the internets, it's up to the contract.
At least I can recall seeing a "Measures Act" on a pub board.
---------- Post added at 13:25 ---------- Previous post was at 13:18 ----------
Sorry but if the T&C's were in anyway ambiguous then they are not legally binding and therefore anyone can walk away
Could you cite authority for that? I'd be interested in reading in researching into this area. Because a lot of consumer T&C's are absoultely rubbish.
Taking a macroscopic view of English jurisprudence, generally Courts are the final authority on ambiguities and it is there job to clear up, as so far as possible, any ambiguous terms.
andygrif
13-03-2007, 15:10
There is provision in law for unfair contracts to be deemed void - the OFT handles such things and you can challenge what you think to be an unfair contract in the courts.
In addition, there is the Unfair Contract Terms Act 2005 which can be seen here:
http://www.lawcom.gov.uk/docs/lc292bill.pdf
There is a section of this that specifically refers to ambiguity in contracts and where the meaning of terms could be taken in more than one way, then the interpretation would be to favour the consumer.
Not sure what bearing this all has on what's being dicussed, but just to let you know that there is law that covers such things.
rogerdraig
13-03-2007, 15:20
this is an area ASA should play more of a part in
i can understand the up to idea but when you have a dial up offer a 2 meg ,4 meg and then 10 meg offer it would seem reasonable that the 10 would give you better than a 4 meg one
perhaps they should be forced to state what the minimum level of service they will provide before either downgrading your price to the lower level or letting you out of contract stated on adverts
here is an example my neighbor is on a 4 meg deal here is his speed test from this site
Tue, 13 Mar 2007 15:15:27 GMT
1st 512K took 2172 ms = 235.7 KB/sec, approx 1942 Kbps, 1.9 Mbps
2nd 512K took 2187 ms = 234.1 KB/sec, approx 1929 Kbps, 1.88 Mbps
3rd 512K took 2157 ms = 237.4 KB/sec, approx 1956 Kbps, 1.91 Mbps
4th 512K took 2140 ms = 239.3 KB/sec, approx 1972 Kbps, 1.93 Mbps
Overall Average Speed = approx 1950 Kbps, 1.9 Mbps
now here is mine on a 2 meg line
Tue, 13 Mar 2007 15:13:21 GMT
1st 512K took 2219 ms = 230.7 KB/sec, approx 1901 Kbps, 1.86 Mbps
2nd 512K took 2125 ms = 240.9 KB/sec, approx 1985 Kbps, 1.94 Mbps
3rd 512K took 2172 ms = 235.7 KB/sec, approx 1942 Kbps, 1.9 Mbps
4th 512K took 2156 ms = 237.5 KB/sec, approx 1957 Kbps, 1.91 Mbps
Overall Average Speed = approx 1946 Kbps, 1.9 Mbps
now hes not about to moan just yet as he isn't paying any more than me but it they up the price he will
as those figures above vary very little no matter what time of day or day of week we have checked quite often i would defy any one no matter what the T&C's say to say that any company could justify charging him more than me for the service
irish beauty
17-03-2008, 23:19
Hi,
I am just posting this cause I am in the process of starting legal proceedings against Virgin Media, basically, I have been paying for the 10MB broadband service since July 2006, and since then have had nothing but problems. I have since been made aware, that a problem was reported on the UBR I was connected to in June 2006, and since then, to this present date has not been checked/repaired or upgraded, yet I have had several engineers out to my house and re-wire the premises and even change my modem as I was always told it was down to a fault on my end.
After this time, and many many complaints sent to Virgin Media's head office, and no responses, I am now going to under take legal action under their own Terms and Conditions and Code of Practice, both of which they have broken since I joined their service back in July 2006. At the end of the day, I am doing this not only for myself, but it seems that Virgin are so contempt at breaking their own rules, and providing the customer with lac-luster services.
Please, let me know of any problems and the length of time you have been suffering, just so I can get some more information on this, as it seems the only way to get something done, is for someone to take legal action and give them a swift kick in the balls.
Thanks, Andrew Robinson.
hi andrew. i really fo hate to say this but your dates are all wrong. first things first 10mb bbnd was not rolled out across the country until late 2006, so up until then you would only have been receiving 4mb. to agree with everyone else why not disconnect, if you have had ongoing problems with your broadband and your telephone then why keep keep the service you do not like.
this may sound really obvious, have you come to a deadlock situation with Virgin media. if not you will be unable to take them to cisas. if this is not reached whereby you and Virgin media do not come to an agreement then they will refuse the case. they will decide whether to take on your case.
you can receive upto 10mb depending how far you live from the junction boxes. i highly doubt you will win. good luck
hi andrew. i really fo hate to say this but your dates are all wrong. first things first 10mb bbnd was not rolled out across the country until late 2006, so up until then you would only have been receiving 4mb. to agree with everyone else why not disconnect, if you have had ongoing problems with your broadband and your telephone then why keep keep the service you do not like.
this may sound really obvious, have you come to a deadlock situation with Virgin media. if not you will be unable to take them to cisas. if this is not reached whereby you and Virgin media do not come to an agreement then they will refuse the case. they will decide whether to take on your case.
you can receive upto 10mb depending how far you live from the junction boxes. i highly doubt you will win. good luck
Thats not true for Cable.
In all this thread why hasn't any one mentioned contention!!!! Isn't it 20:1 on a cable connection. Which on a 10mb connection would actually only gaurantee you half a meg. the rest is bustable when other people arn't using there share of the connection.
tweetypie/8
18-03-2008, 14:12
lol
i think he is going to need it.
did no one look at the original date of the OP ?
he didnt get back so i wonder what happened.....
---------- Post added at 14:28 ---------- Previous post was at 14:26 ----------
i think 20:1 is business, 50:1 is residental
CardinalFang
19-03-2008, 21:36
just a little aside, lots of talk about the veracity of virgin's T&Cs, eg:
...Yes I'm sure Virgin Media et al have paid some very expensive solicitors to write their terms and conditions...
it must be about 5/6 years ago now when I was working for ntl, and virgin net (as it was was then) was quite new. Virgin's "very expensive solicitors" didn't bother writing their T&Cs themselves, they used the good old sheep mentality and plagiarised the T&Cs from Pipex, mostly verbatim and omitting to remove one of the actual instances of "Pipex Internet" !! LoL.
didn't take them long to remove it but don't make the automatic assumption that just because they're a big company their T&Cs are 100% watertight and professional. not to mention that even if the T&Cs explicitly stated there was no service level whatsoever that wouldn't protect them from basic consumer rights legislation.
did no one look at the original date of the OP ?...
LOL
I got to the second page before I realised the thread was started over a year ago. Doh!
.
bigcats30
21-03-2008, 01:13
you cant walk away and enjoy the rest of your life and cancel your services , becuse your with them for 12 months.i do have problem with mine and told me they can Not fix my problem so i told them if it ok if i cancel my services they said yeah no problem but need to pay 280.00 !!!:mad:
then your a mug for letting them!!! they can't supply you with the service you paid for so you pay them anyway you sound like an idiot to me
---------- Post added at 01:13 ---------- Previous post was at 01:10 ----------
I agree that, if I was in OP's position, I'd rather invest the energy in getting my internet from elsewhere but ...
Virgin obviously have to provide some basic level of service. I'd be surprised of the contract does not have a 'get out' clause for the customer if Virgin cannot provide a decent level of service. (Sky's contract does, for example). Companies cannot hide behind unfair terms of contracts anymore.
But again, it appears the OP has received some compensations thus far..
EXACTLY just because it says something doesn't mean they can enforce it.....any judge will see that if the terms and conditions are way unfair then he will give in favour of the customer
CrazyMonk
23-03-2008, 00:08
I have had pretty much the exact same problems with AOL about a year ago (2 years of agonisingly slow speeds and service you cannot imagine...) Taking them to court would have set my father back a large sum (Had the case looked at externally) the company is just too big to take on, especially with their sneaky T&S and tightly written conditions.
In the end we just got out, asked to leave (Still had 8 Months contract left) they said ok, heres the bill. We simply said, no - You have failed to provide the service we constantly pay for and under some sort of act (cant quite remember) we demand to have out mac address released and be done with it..
Realising our anger and position, they decided that cutting us loose was the best option. Just get slightly aggressive on the phone or in writing. Dont waste money and time trying to battle the giants.
I know how you must feel i and many others have been their, £25 for dial up speeds did crazy things to me. Just leave, they will always win.
I have had pretty much the exact same problems with AOL about a year ago (2 years of agonisingly slow speeds and service you cannot imagine...) Taking them to court would have set my father back a large sum (Had the case looked at externally) the company is just too big to take on, especially with their sneaky T&S and tightly written conditions.
In the end we just got out, asked to leave (Still had 8 Months contract left) they said ok, heres the bill. We simply said, no - You have failed to provide the service we constantly pay for and under some sort of act (cant quite remember) we demand to have out mac address released and be done with it..
Realising our anger and position, they decided that cutting us loose was the best option. Just get slightly aggressive on the phone or in writing. Dont waste money and time trying to battle the giants.
I know how you must feel i and many others have been their, £25 for dial up speeds did crazy things to me. Just leave, they will always win.
then you were given really bad advice.
when dealing with these businesses thats what the small claim courts are for, you need to read up on it, and learn your rights (and then pass it on to the next end user in line ;) ).
start with the bank charges threads on the CAG ,taking in all the points needed.
including our good friend the DPA notice, the DPA request, dealing with CRAs, and unlawful charges, these will be your must eye opening options and its quite likely your old ISP was processing your data and adding charges for services and sending to the CRA's etc after the contract was finished etc.
http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legalities/24013-defaults-proposed-method-removal.html
surlyBonds is always a good read, then look at the new ISP and other sections.
the bank charges ripoff did us all (well most, if you can be bothered to make the time) a favour in the long run, as we were forced to learn why and how to use the DPA, consumer law and all the rest to stop UK firms milking the comsumer for every penny.
remember, that T&C consumer contract is there for the benefit of BOTH partys, not just the companys benefit that are taking your cash, use it.
you have a choice, let your (ex)ISP roll you over and mess with your credit rating etc,or write a few registered post official notice/request letters and spend a £10+.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lordy http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/12/33609910-legal-action-against-virgin-media-post-34245002.html#post34245002)
I agree that, if I was in OP's position, I'd rather invest the energy in getting my internet from elsewhere but ...
Virgin obviously have to provide some basic level of service. I'd be surprised of the contract does not have a 'get out' clause for the customer if Virgin cannot provide a decent level of service. (Sky's contract does, for example). Companies cannot hide behind unfair terms of contracts anymore.
But again, it appears the OP has received some compensations thus far..
EXACTLY just because it says something doesn't mean they can enforce it.....any judge will see that if the terms and conditions are way unfair then he will give in favour of the customer
you dont need a judge, OC you always have the small claims N1 and on-line versions to use if you so wish, for a direct to the point option,bypassing the OFT, DC or any other govt body if you like.
http://www.oft.gov.uk/advice_and_resources/publications/guidance/unfair-terms-consumer/
http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/34215359-post567.html
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