View Full Version : Too hot to work?
If my place of employment was uncomfortably warm in this weather and there were concerns amongst the staff as to their health while at work, does anyone know the relevant organisation we'd need to contact?
Lord Nikon
09-08-2003, 17:23
the HSE (Health & Safety Executive) Perhaps?
Unless you are in an office type enviroment unfortunately there are no maximum working temps. HSE is the way to go for more information. http://www.hse.gov.uk/
Out of interest what are the max working temps in an office
timewarrior2001
09-08-2003, 17:59
Not sure on the max temp, but I did find this little snippet on the web:-
"A comfortable temperature for sedentary work is between 20 and 24 degrees C, with relative air humidity (the water content in the air) between 40% and 60%. "
Not sure if thats legal requirement etc or if its an official guide.
Also this:-
"HSE have produced a publication called Thermal Comfort in the Workplace HSG194, ISBN 0717624684, £3.50, which provides further guidance.
Although there is no maximum temperature stated in the regulations, the guidance states:
'An acceptable zone of thermal comfort for most people in the UK lies roughly between 13°C (56°F) and 30°C (86°F), with acceptable temperatures for more strenuous work activities concentrated towards the bottom end of the range, and more sedentary activities towards the higher end.
Because the maximum temperature is not stated in the regulation itself, the status of the ACOP must be explained and some cases may require advice or interpretation. "
Which seems more official.
I think it means that if the temp/humidity goes outside that, you can claim the working environment is uncomfortable, and your employer either has to let you go home or do something to make it comfortable again
I'm in an office in a section of a call centre, I wonder how this affects me....
One of the guys in work was surfing the internet last week and mentioned that they (HSE?) were looking into an upper limit for a working temperature!
I am not sure where he was reading this but will ask him next week, it was either the HSE or one of the unions I think.
I must admit that I was not listening that hard.
grum1978
09-08-2003, 18:48
Originally posted by Escapee
One of the guys in work was surfing the internet last week and mentioned that they (HSE?) were looking into an upper limit for a working temperature!
I am not sure where he was reading this but will ask him next week, it was either the HSE or one of the unions I think.
I must admit that I was not listening that hard.
spot on they are looking at bringing in legislation for a upper limit HSE i *think*:D
At work all week they have got fans by the desks and they bring round drinks and ice lollies its great, they have also let us wear shorts and t-shirts to work. Long live the hot weather :D
Having a nice hot summer, eh? :D
grum1978
09-08-2003, 19:50
its been in the 90's all week and willbe for most of next week :D
homealone
09-08-2003, 20:08
Originally posted by Jerrek
Having a nice hot summer, eh? :D
supposed to get near 100°F tomorrow.
Feel for you guys in Canada, though - those forest fires don't look good. :(
Originally posted by grum1978
its been in the 90's all week and willbe for most of next week :D They said that it will last till the end of August:D
Well, as already pointed out... by many ;) your local HSE officer/representative should be called upon to inspect the workplace and any negotaitions should be taken from there :)
UNISON has this to add....
http://www.unison.org.uk/safety/doc_view.asp?did=184
May not be relevant to your workplace directly but may help along with the HSE site posted before.
As far as i can see... while the HSE doesn't have, as yet, a maximum limit on temperatures involving heat ... it's guidance on the matter is as follows;
During hot weather, employers should try to ensure reasonable comfort by......
- providing air cooling or air conditioning plant;
- providing fans;
- ensuring that windows can be opened;
- shading windows with blinds;
- siting workstations away from direct sunlight;
- providing additional facilities, e.g. cold water
dispensers;
- allowing sufficient breaks to enable employees to get
cold drinks or to cool down;
- introducing working practices such as flexible hours or
earlier starts to the working day to avoid the worst
effects of working in exceptionally high temperatures;
and
- relaxing formal dress codes (but personal protective
equipment must be used, if required).
Got to go back to work Monday, after swimming in the Solent and fishing, picnicking in the New forestÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šà ¬Ã‚Â¦. two magnificent weeks HOLIDAY.
†œUtopiaà€ÂÂ
S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T S**T
Back to
Hot, humming, airless, burning, stinking, boiling, sweaty, stifling and roasting, etc.
Fâ₠™in City Offices
Fr4nk
Originally posted by homealone
supposed to get near 100°F tomorrow.
Feel for you guys in Canada, though - those forest fires don't look good. :(
Feels like over 100°F already here....
- providing air cooling or air conditioning plant;
- providing fans;
- ensuring that windows can be opened;
- shading windows with blinds;
- providing additional facilities, e.g. cold water
dispensers;
- allowing sufficient breaks to enable employees to get
cold drinks or to cool down;
- relaxing formal dress codes (but personal protective
equipment must be used, if required).
They are doing the above but it's still unbearable.
Originally posted by Russ D
They are doing the above but it's still unbearable.
Well, i had to take a week off work to avoid it..... from my annual leave :shrug: and now the damn unbearble heat is going to continue for what seems like an eternity :(
The only comfort we have is two fans.... one is in the front office and the second is my desk fan which i brought in from home.. and has since, in my absence, been checked and labelled functioning and safe by HSE with the NHS property labels..... so if i remove it from the premises.. i'll be accused of stealing my own fan!! :grind:
Our one floor building has a glass roof and the only windows that open at all are the ones in the public area....
I was emailed by my colleague on wednesday that our manager suffered heat stroke on wednesday in the office... i can't wait to get back on monday :cry:
My manager has tried to buy more fans but none of the shops seem to have any in stock..... no surpise there ;)
If management has done everything it can within the legal limits to make their employees comfortable but if it's still too cold..... we'd be entitled to go home...... with the heat, since there is no limit as yet.... i suppose it would be up to the employer.
But if you can prove that the enviroment is unhealthy and will have a detrimental effect on your health.. which i think you can judging by the UNISON document,.. then you may be able to get time off :shrug:
But it would be tough... since almost everyone without air conditioning at work would be claiming the same :(
I'm sure i could find medical evidence (evidence based medicine) which highlights the detrimental effects of overheating at work....
let me know, if you'd like me to look :)
But i'd do it quickly.. it could be snowing in a month :D
Ok.... did a little research (my job)... thought it was worth it since monday is looming and found this...
International standards for the assessment of the risk of thermal strain on clothed workers in hot environments.
Parsons KC.
Human Thermal Environments Laboratory, Loughborough University, Leicestershire, UK.
The International Standards Organisation (ISO) has produced an integrated series of international standards for the assessment of human responses to thermal environments. They include standards for the assessment of thermal comfort, heat stress and cold stress and many have been adopted as European and British standards. This paper describes the series of standards and in particular those concerned with the assessment of risk in hot environments. A three tier approach is taken which involves a simple thermal index that can be used for monitoring and control of hot environments (ISO 7243), a rational approach which involves an analysis of the heat exchange between a worker and his or her environment (ISO 7933) and a standard that describes the principles of physiological measurement which can be used in the establishment of personal monitoring systems of workers exposed to hot environments (ISO 9886). The standards are self-contained and can be used independently. In any comprehensive assessment however they would be used in conjunction. The simple index provides a first stage analysis and can confirm whether or not there is likely to be unacceptable thermal strain. Where a more detailed analysis is required then ISO 7933 provides an analytical method that can provide a more extensive assessment and interpretation leading to recommendations for improvement to the working environment. Where a method needs to be confirmed, or conditions are beyond the scope of ISO 7243 and ISO 7933, then ISO 9886 provides guidance on physiological measurement and interpretation. This would be used in extreme environments where individual responses are required to ensure health and safety or, in the case where personal protective equipment (PPE) is worn, which is beyond the scope of ISO 7243 and ISO 7933. The ISO system therefore covers almost all exposures to hot environments....
Looks like there should be ISO standards if not HSE ones, but these may well have only ever been used for workers in industrial plants where thermal stress has always been relevant :erm:
But given the changes in the workplace that we are experiencing due to higher tempertures than normal, and the fact that this is likely to continue in future summers.... perhaps they are worth taking a look at? :shrug:
Right.... now has anyone access to ISO standards? :D They're expensive to get hold of and the copyright around them is a mine field :(
Lord Nikon
10-08-2003, 00:12
ISO 7730 may also apply
Complying with ASHRAE 55 (1992) or ISO 7730 (1984) means:
· Maintaining the operative temperature between 20°C to 23.5°C in winter
and between 22.5°C and 26°C in summer.
· Maintaining the relative humidity level between 30 to 60%
· An activity level of <= 1.2 met (70 W/m2), clothing resistance of 1
clo in winter and 0.5 clo in summer and air velocity <= 0.25 m/s to
prevent the sensation of draft (the three parameters and the associated
values are typical of any office environment. Furniture layout can
sometimes result in poor air-distribution exacerbating both local
thermal discomfort as well as IEQ problems)
[EDIT] also see http://www.zunis.org/how_hot_is_hot_how_safe_is_safe.htm
Well, this summer has been rather mild here, with temperatures in the high 20s and low 30s. (Canada uses Celsius btw.) We've had a few days with an unbearable humidex but other than that it is much better than last year where we got 40s for several days a week.
Now in Arizona... It annoys me to no end when the locals smile at you, a foreigner, especially since I'm Canadian, when they smile at me with a toothy smile and say "It is getting pretty warm, eh?" when it reads 115 F...
Originally posted by Z4pp4
Got to go back to work Monday, after swimming in the Solent
Tell your boss that and call in sick for the rest of the summer!
I wouldn't want to swim in the Solent, water should be clear or blue, not brown! :D
zoombini
10-08-2003, 09:48
Afaikr, there is a legal requirement for the air quality inside to be as good as the air outside.
So if itts all stuffy & hard to breath because of the heat then thats grounds for complaint.
As a suggestion, what we did in our office was close (yes close!)
the windows, open the doors at each end of the room and have some big old fans at one end blowing out of one door.
It creates a vacuum in the room and draws fresh air in from the other door. Bought the temperature down a few degreees pretty quickly.
Luckily were getting proper air conditioning units fitted shortyly (they are sat outside stores) but might have to turn all the PC's and lights off to power them..lol
The latest rumour is that air con isn't going to be installed until NOVEMBER!!
Who on earth needs air conditioning in november???
zoombini
10-08-2003, 10:09
Well, at least you will have it from then on.
Unfortunately the units that we have just had fitted at the front offices all take 30 amp startup and 13 amp running.
For 8 units thats an awful drain on the electric, especially when the cable in is at maximum capacity already.
Apparently it will cost 22k to fit a bigger one.
1/2 the lights on the shopfloor had tubes removed, so I have no idea whats going to happen when 4 more get added for the offices at the rear of the building.
Maybe they get it a tad cheaper having it fitted in November, or maybe the installers cannot do it until then because they have run out or are too busy due to the demand.
Originally posted by grum1978
spot on they are looking at bringing in legislation for a upper limit HSE i *think*:D <snip>
Yeah they are looking into it, will probably be 40°C or something stupid so it never comes into force, knowing how things go :rolleyes:
Originally posted by kink
During hot weather, employers should try to ensure reasonable comfort by......<snip>
Ha I wish!! We have some fans, but they just blow the hot stuffy air around, was at lease 32°C in our office last week.
The windows in the office are big, but the bit that opens is small, and opens about 3 inches, wow THAT helps!
Every year the subject of air conditions comes up, and the answer is always no chance :mad: the bloody computers in the computer room get air con, but not us poor workers :spin:
"providing additional facilities, e.g. cold water dispensers"
No extra facilities at all, the drinks machines are now forever running out of drinks, as are the cans, and they only get filled once a day.
"relaxing formal dress codes" The best we got to that was deciding not to wear ties in the office.
At least I'm on a course at Microsoft in Reading on Mon Tues & Weds, surely they must have air con :D
I'm off to take a cold shower now :p
:wavey:
Isn't an air con unit little more than a bowl of water in front of a fan? I might try and knock up a home-made air con system Homer Simpson style!
Dave Stones
10-08-2003, 12:17
Originally posted by Russ D
Isn't an air con unit little more than a bowl of water in front of a fan? I might try and knock up a home-made air con system Homer Simpson style!
honestly i thought you would know better than to steal from your neighbours ;)
or do you mean strapping a ping pong bat to your cat's tail and sitting it in front of an icecube? teehee
i watch the simpsons waaaaay too much...
[edit] maybe i should set up a tent in front of my fridge homer simpson style... ;)
homealone
10-08-2003, 12:31
Originally posted by Russ D
Isn't an air con unit little more than a bowl of water in front of a fan? I might try and knock up a home-made air con system Homer Simpson style!
air cons de-humidify the air as a result of cooling it, the condensed water has to be piped away or collected in a tank. So sorry Russ - thats a DOH!:)
Russ D saidThe latest rumour is that air con isn't going to be installed until NOVEMBER!!
One of the departments in the company that I work for compained about the lack of air conditioning a few months ago.
The room has about 6 people working in it, and because of the high security equipment the windows are fixed shut.
I had to work in there for a week and it was unbearable and the weather was nowhere near as hot as it is now. To be fair to them though they had aircon installed within a few weeks.
Companies that have employees working in unbearable conditions just don't care about there employees, if it's a one man and his dog outfit scratching for a living it's understandable.
Large companies treating people this way just show their true colours.
Hey, Russ at least you had the benefit of aircon at ntl, would you swap your present job to go back into the nice aircon office at ntl though?;)
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