Government & Post Election Discussion

[denphone]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

The problems with the NHS are not altogether new and the current model is unsustainable. You do not acknowledge the way in which the NHS has been made less bureaucratic (with the abolition of the expensive Primary Care Trusts), the investment put in to train up new doctors (that will take a full decade from when this increase was implemented to come through), the changes that are being implemented to increase the hours of opening of doctor's surgeries, and so on.

.

Strange how earlier you said Mr Hunt was doing a mighty fine job and that everything in our NHS was pretty fine and dandy.

---------- Post added at 14:36 ---------- Previous post was at 14:32 ----------

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Unfortunately, the NHS is so unwieldy that it takes forever to turn the ship around, but turn it will. And let's not forget that when the Coalition Government came to power, Labour said it would be reckless to put more money into the NHS.

So it might be worth a thought to consider what the state of the NHS would be now had Labour got in.

Both parties have been pretty inept at running the NHS as sadly both put party politics and points scoring before anything else sadly.

---------- Post added at 14:41 ---------- Previous post was at 14:36 ----------

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

He inherited a mess, remember, and he is having to deal with a worsening situation in a post recession situation. You don't expect much, do you? As I said, Labour would not have done anything positive with the NHS.

Good grief it would be a mighty fine day when some could think and look beyond their own narrow politics whatever colour that is to see things through unbiased non-partisan eyes and then they might actually learn something...

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by denphone

Strange how earlier you said Mr Hunt was doing a mighty fine job and that everything in our NHS was pretty fine and dandy.

---------- Post added at 14:36 ---------- Previous post was at 14:32 ----------



Both parties have been pretty inept at running the NHS as sadly both put party politics and points scoring before anything else sadly.

---------- Post added at 14:41 ---------- Previous post was at 14:36 ----------



Good grief it would be a mighty fine day when some could think and look beyond their own narrow politics whatever colour that is to see things through unbiased non-partisan eyes and then they might actually learn something...

why not give that a try then

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by denphone

Strange how earlier you said Mr Hunt was doing a mighty fine job and that everything in our NHS was pretty fine and dandy.

OMG, Den, you haven't taken account of anything I have said!

Jeremy Hunt is trying hard to turn the NHS around when Labour was saying we should not pump any more into it!!!

I can't believe you can't see that!

I have never said everything in the NHS was 'fine and dandy'! Are you hallucinating? (Sorry, I had to ask!).

I said it would take a while to turn it around with a limited budget.

Please let's get real, Den. What would you propose to turn this around? It's all very well to criticise from the sidelines.

---------- Post added at 19:27 ---------- Previous post was at 19:25 ----------

Originally Posted by denphone

Good grief it would be a mighty fine day when some could think and look beyond their own narrow politics whatever colour that is to see things through unbiased non-partisan eyes and then they might actually learn something...

Yes, give that a go, Den!

Pah! I see no evidence that Hunt is turning anything around.Quite the reverse. 24/7 NHS isn't possible without the staff to deliver it. The best way is to make sure that A&Es can function 24/7 and forget the idea that all NHS services can be available 24/7.Besides which who needs podiatry care at the weekend as a matter of urgency?

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Pah! I see no evidence that Hunt is turning anything around.Quite the reverse. 24/7 NHS isn't possible without the staff to deliver it. The best way is to make sure that A&Es can function 24/7 and forget the idea that all NHS services can be available 24/7.Besides which who needs podiatry care at the weekend as a matter of urgency?

Whether Labour is control or not, I assume you are saying, Maggy.

I do understand the frustration, but I don't understand the view of the 'faithful' that Labour could solve this.

Remember, they would not have put any more money into the NHS. The Conservatives have.

Why is nobody acknowledging this?

Must be blind, socialist, faith.

At least the Conservatives are moving forward, not backwards!

[heero_yuy]

But, but, but, Jeremy Corbyn is the second messiah, will release all that money that the nasty baby eating Tories have been hiding away, and will turn the country into the land of milk and honey where everybody has a house, will never want for anything, and the NHS will provide every treatment known to man for no money.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

But, but, but, Jeremy Corbyn is the second messiah, will release all that money that the nasty baby eating Tories have been hiding away, and will turn the country into the land of milk and honey where everybody has a house, will never want for anything, and the NHS will provide every treatment known to man for no money.

Or maybe he'll just work to make the country a bit of a fairer place to live, one where a millionaires cleaner doesn't pay more tax than they do or where multinationals making millions pay less in tax than I do, that would get my vote what wouldn't get my vote is someone spouting meaningless platitudes like strong and stable leadership, especially when they aren't even capable of delivering on that

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Whether Labour is control or not, I assume you are saying, Maggy.

I do understand the frustration, but I don't understand the view of the 'faithful' that Labour could solve this.

Remember, they would not have put any more money into the NHS. The Conservatives have.

Why is nobody acknowledging this?

Must be blind, socialist, faith.

At least the Conservatives are moving forward, not backwards!

On one post, you're accusing Labour of future reckless spending, on another, you say they would spend less than the Conservatives. It's hard to discuss this when your opinions on Labour spending are still being formulated.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

On one post, you're accusing Labour of future reckless spending, on another, you say they would spend less than the Conservatives. It's hard to discuss this when your opinions on Labour spending are still being formulated.

It was Labour who said it would be 'reckless' to spend more money on the NHS.

That doesn't detract from the fact that they would waste money on all the wrong things and bankrupt the economy if they returned to power.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Remember, they would not have put any more money into the NHS. The Conservatives have.
Why is nobody acknowledging this?

Because the only person who hasn't made the effort to check if the statement is correct is you! Took me a few seconds to find this article.

Labour says it will spend an extra £37bn on the NHS in England over the next five years if it wins power.
The investment, including £10bn on upgrading IT systems and repairing buildings, would be funded by tax increases and capital borrowing.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39916367

I'm not saying that Labour should spend this amount on the NHS nor am I arguing whether the party's sums add up. I'm just pointing out that they have said they will spend more on it if elected.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

But, but, but, Jeremy Corbyn is the second messiah, will release all that money that the nasty baby eating Tories have been hiding away, and will turn the country into the land of milk and honey where everybody has a house, will never want for anything, and the NHS will provide every treatment known to man for no money.

and some folks actually believe it...

Really what's the difference between their unconditional approval of Corbyn and the inability for some on here to accept criticism of the current government? It's the same tribalism just a different tribe.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Damien

Really what's the difference between their unconditional approval of Corbyn and the inability for some on here to accept criticism of the current government? It's the same tribalism just a different tribe.

Spot on Damien. Both parties are significantly flawed and alternatives like Ukip and the LibDems are in the long grass.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by Damien

Really what's the difference between their unconditional approval of Corbyn and the inability for some on here to accept criticism of the current government? It's the same tribalism just a different tribe.

Indeed some find it absolutely incapable of criticizing anything of their own political persuasion on here as it seems all the other political parties have got everything wrong and their party has got everything right and if ever there was a delusion then that is it as in my book both parties have made a almighty balls up these past few years but sadly neither them and their partisan supporters will ever admit to it.

[heero_yuy]

I'm quite happy to criticise the current administration and I think Hammond would be a liability running a cake stand in a church bazaar let alone the treasury. That some think that Corbyn's rabble could do a better job just defies belief.

But I'm sure those supporters will be quite able to pay their mortgages with a 10% bank rate rather than the current 0.5%